There's nothing in it for the employer to give feedback to candidates they passed up on as it exposes them to lawsuits on the grounds of discriminatory practices.

I've been on the hiring side. A lot of the time it comes down to fit. It's hard to defend fit if companies get sued.

i wonder if we can start a subthread on the continuing topic....

until then...

Fit is the most bs term.

I use lack of fit when i can't publicly state why i didn't hire a person (i'm looking for a lifer who is late 30's early 40's who is finished having kids(or no intention for kids) because i need stability in the role and a mother figure to herd juniors because i dont have time for their bs.

Fit is also when you must publicly post the role but you know the VP's friends daughter is already selected and no matter you have MBA CPA LLB DR - VP's friend's daughter is getting the job due to better cultural fit.

Ask any HR to define what fit they are looking for and watch they throw buzz words like "entrepreurial minded, "work hard play hard attitude" and ask them to define those using the STAR attribute" and watch them go wtf.

Speaking as an old fart who has been around the block for a bit, I'd tell you this -- get used to it. This is how the real world works. A company (or equivalent) is looking for the right person to suit their needs, and if you aren't that person, you are nothing to them. They are not your mom and dad, meaning that they have no responsibility to look after you if your ego got injured as a result of not getting hired.

Now, when you do get hired, the good companies (or those with good management) will make some effort to accommodate you and your pecularities. At that point, you are an asset to them. But don't get too comfortable because even if you were to be in a union gig, if management wants to get rid of you, chances are they will find a way.

That's specifically where I'm looking. Haven't had any successes so far, but still looking for opportunities every day.

The vast majority of my closest friends are either working for their parents, have specializations (CPA, RE, MD, etc.), are unfathomably rich and don't really work, or are a combination of these :badpokerface: no one to really give me a solid referral.

Totally understand this, and I agree 100%. Maybe I'm just feeling blue from constant rejection.

I guess we can't have it all can we? To tie things together with the relationship theme of this thread, my relationship is beyond excellent right now, but my career is incredibly meh.

Unfathomably rich? How do you even put a number to its definition?

Part of the problem is that with Vancouver being a such a great place to live, there's always a backlog of overqualified people willing to work in lower roles with lower pays. At my previous work, I worked with three coworkers in their 30's and 40's that took massive pay cuts (I'm guessing at least 50% even though their pay is still in 6 figures) to live in Vancouver. One had a top-tier MBA and two were from top-tier banks like Goldman from London and HK. I see similar examples all the time in accounting, tech, engineering etc.. IMO, Vancouver is terrible place for young people to grow their careers, assuming you have the drive and the intellectual potential. There's just not enough job opportunities with good growth potential. The difference I see among my peers' career trajectories between those who stayed in Vancouver vs people who left for bigger job markets is astronomical in 10 years. My advice is to explore your options outside of Van asap. You're young and have nothing to lose, don't let the allure of how beautiful and comfortable this city is prevent you from exploring your full potential.

When I was applying for my current job, I had a similar experience. Over 4 months I went through 5 rounds, ~10 interviews. HR didn't even have the courtesy to let me know I didn't get the job and I had to chase after them to receive that rejection. But guess what? I sucked it up and contacted the same HR recruiter again after 3 months and let her know that I'm still interested and willing to go through the same interview process if a similar role pops up in the future. I'm not sure if that correspondence reminded her that I was still out there but she let me know that one of the managers I interviewed with (among the previous ~10 interviews) was hiring and had a really good impression and was considering me along with other new candidates. After a few months, I got the job because I aced all my previous interviews but I was not hired for the previous role based on 'fit' (managers were incentivized to increase diversity scores, whole another story). My advice is, if you really like the company and felt you did well on your interviews, don't give up and keep reaching out to the company to let them know that you're still out there and motivated to work for them. Funny thing is, my partner is also working for her current dream job through a similar second opportunity. So don't sleep on second chances; if you made a great impression, they will remember you.

Yeah I agree - I really want to continue with this discussion because there's a lot of great gems being thrown out here.

Perhaps we can do a speak it out thread similar to this relationship one, but for work-related stuff, where we can just speak our thoughts related to work?

Not sure which section it would fall under though.

Unfathomably rich=they can go to any restaurant in the world and order without looking at the menu price and place their Amex without hesitation after dinner is over.

You guys can do that too, you know that right?

Huh, I guess that makes me unfathomably rich :lol

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but for the past 5 years I've used SIO for anything I just wanted to talk about, vent, or just need advice. I think this topic has been discussed many times in SIO, but still has a place in SIO.

Having said that, it could be put in the Employment/Career resources section.

I'm sure we must all remember 14 Dollar Baller.

Even back then when I was making sub-$14 an hour, every week I would go to restaurants and order without looking at the prices...







McDonalds and Bao Chau are restaurants right? :lol

I feel you bro; times are tough. Great vibe all around and still lose at the end. It freaking sucks.
Went thru this sample exercise on a IT hipster San Fran type start up... took me 4 days to do a presentation (following their curriculum etc). And you're right, just one simple email... "sorry, we went with someone better"blah blah blah......just a copy & paste too bad so sad email.

Didn't even want to debrief.

9 out of 10 times... people lose out due to referrals / internal hire etc. I got defeated twice on an amazing opportunity in March. Went super emo... and now due to COVID... there are nothign going on.

What i learned is to never BLAME yourself.
a) maybe I said soemthign wrong
b) maybe my email wasn't good enough
c) I should have done this instead etc.

You will soon spiral into a dark hole and won't ever come back out. If you don't get a job, never blame yourself on the could have should have... Most of the times, its out of your control.

I'm not sure if I ever shared this here, but my close friends including some of those who are on here, knew that prior to taking my current job, gf and I had actually decided that we'd be moving to Tokyo. It was initially me who did the convincing (I absolutely LOVE Tokyo, it's such an incredible city) because gf was skeptical obviously (not as much passion towards Japan as me, and no Japanese language skills) but after much back and forth, she began to see my reasoning.

- We're young, and both see the lack of growth opportunities in Vancouver for those with ambitions, and both struggle with our careers
- When the only reasons to STAY in Vancouver are that it's very chill and comfortable, you know there's a problem
- Working your ass off in a 9-8 job and rising through the ranks within 3 years (all my friends who moved back to HK/Taipei/Tokyo after graduation) versus having maybe only 2 hours of work to do out of a 9-5 job with a 1.5hr lunch, and not really experiencing much, if any growth, it should be obvious what the answer is
- We're both crazy about Japanese food and everything Japanese in general (I'm an ex-weeb and gf also enjoys certain aspects of Japanese culture very much)
- Gf grew up in HK and I've always hated the country bumpkin lifestyle in Vancouver (wE'rE a WoRlD cLaSs CiTy) of a tiny city trying to be something that it's not, so she's very accustomed to the big city lifestyle and I've always dreamed of living in a huge metropolitan REAL world-class city, and after several trips to Tokyo together, we were sure we'd greatly enjoy living there

We went as far as to begin taking Japanese lessons, and I began networking on a daily basis to increase my contacts in Japan, reaching out to existing friends and friends of friends, as well as random people (I even had a long back and forth email conversation with Derek with Pacific Coast Auto on career prospects for a non-Japanese person like myself). I began looking into the different types of visas, everything associated with housing including rentals, different areas to live in, etc. etc. etc. BASICALLY we were super serious about moving.

And yes, for all of you people that are thinking in your head hahaha this stupid gaijin wanting to move to Tokyo thinking it's all fine and dandy and the best place in the world through his rose coloured glasses, we did absolutely consider that and we were completely aware of how significant of a change our lives would go through, and how Japanese culture isn't exactly the friendliest thing. These are things we took into consideration, but were hardships we were willing to experience (not exactly hardships, it's just how things are there vs the retirement city that is Vancouver).

Till this day, I'm not sure why I expected that this current role I'm in would fix everything and make me be able to stay in Vancouver. To be frank, I'm quite disappointed in this company and how they duped the recruiter (spoke with her afterwards about the toxic things that were happening and she said wtf that isn't what they told me and empathized with me at least).

Long story short: I'm thinking of moving to Tokyo again...shouldn't have put off that dream of ours. Lots of planning to do. It's a big LIFE move, takes a lot of planning.

Then become unfathomably in debt :lawl:

It's tough not to be hard on yourself, especially for me since I'm a bit of an OCD perfectionist :okay:

I've been utilizing a spreadsheet since 2003. For me, growing up lower-middle class taught me a lot and it taught me quickly how stark life is especially if you're unprepared. On the other end, when money flows, everything becomes an addiction and therein lies the dangers. Then you add in just how easy it is to obtain credit and so there lies your potholes and pitfalls. Tread carefully and keep a map with you if you're going to walk alone. Also, a man worth $1 million is poor in a room with people who are worth $5million.

As the years went on and I kept reading stories about CDN debt levels getting higher and higher and this is coupled with some of the things we pay the highest fees for in the developed world, Tack on the talk about 'how would we fare if a superbug attacked us?' articles and I knew something damaging was coming. I'm not one to get caught in hysteria but the points I was listening to were valid and well researched. There's just no exact moment in time where you set the timer and say "when the big hand reaches 12, it's happening".

But, while the timer clicks slowly between the 11 and 12, many people are already on the precipice, running in their hamster wheel as fast they can, only looking straight, trying so hard not to slow down.

It doesn't help that making money easy to obtain is another kind of epidemic thanks to lax banking regulations. Seems like not much was learned from the financial events of 2008 but hey, we are now in the world of '15 minute and forget it' syndrome. Anyone remember what was making the news 8 months ago? No? You're not the only one.

Though I was able to land a career and eventually a long term job (it was bloody tough), I still save a lot. I only buy something (i.e. a car) when I know there's enough money there that won't tip the scale into red's favour. That said, I've always lived cheap. That just comes with never forgetting my roots and my childhood dinners that consisted of salted rice with butter.

A rainy day fund is essential. It rains a lot in Vancouver.

I normally don't post a lot here or in this level of depth but I will give it a shot. Excuse the typos and grammatical errors if you will.

I'm not going to tell people how to spend their money, or dictate what they do with their money, but what I can tell you is that if you truly believe your friends are unfathomably rich, you need to dig deeper, or look further because I can assure you, there is more than what meets the eye.

I get that it's easy to jump to conclusions that our "friends" who are professionals who don't bat an eye when they dine out, or make a big ticket purchase every now and then. We've all fallen for that. But do we really know what comes in to their bank accounts, is equivalent of what comes out? (i.e. fancy dinners and fancy Instagram vacations etc.) or what sacrifices they've had to make, like pulling in extra hours than most normal people would. Missing out on friends birthdays, family dinners, opportunities to socialize and enjoy life? We don't know that. The idea and concept of those who are unfathomably rich is subjective. For all we know, they could be still living at home, rent free, and expense free. All the income is just discretionary at this point. Of course they can afford to pull out their low-interest AMEX for that fancy dinner.

There are reliable and verified pools of data and statistics that exist on the Internet on income, levels of education, demographics and all. Spend some time to look into it and then decide for yourself if your friends are truly unfathomably rich or not. Some of you folks have made it seem like debt avoidance is a top priority; Again, I'm not going to judge whether what you prioritize is right or wrong, but there is more to life than just debt avoidance. Maybe consider simply spending wisely and not overspend like your typical Asian baby girl who graduated from UBC with an Arts degree flaunting her shit with a $45,000 annual salary. Some people are better (and smarter) at spending their money. If you had an opportunity of buying a $65,000 car at 0% interest over 5 years, would you take advantage of that? Or would you pay up front the entire $65,000 for the sake of avoiding debt? That's for you to decide.

It's evident that some of you folks need to get out and explore the world, and discover life to get a better perspective. I sense that there is some resentment and bitterness towards Vancouver. By no means, is Vancouver a place abundant of jobs and careers. It's a tough market for sure. But if you realize that you've peaked where you are at your place of employment, or in your profession, or line of work, you have to look elsewhere, and that's nobody's responsibility but your own. Had I not left Vancouver several years ago, I wouldn't be where I am today and so called "unfathomably rich." (Shopping at Whole Foods makes you poor, okay?) I would have been stuck in my role forever where I was working, and when I look back at my friends, they are still where they are 5+ years ago. But they are okay with that because they are enjoying their life, making ends meet with their income, and raising their children the way we once grew up. They didn't have to upheave their roots and move elsewhere to chase their financial dreams and careers because that's not who they are, and that's not what they wanted. Turn the tables, they think I am "unfathomably rich." Except they don't know how shitty of a commute I have every day, how many hours I put in at work, and the whole nine yards. It's easy to jump to conclusions, but until you know, you don't know.

I'm a big believer in "can't make it in the kitchen, GTFO" .... the Mrs. and I also pondered about moving out of vancouver. Her idea, not mine. My biggest challenge:

how do you support aging parents?
Flying back from Tokyo to YVR when your parents are in an emergency is not the greatest.

how do you manage life with kids with no parent/friend support?

These are the 2 mains why I don't practice what I preach for my own life.

At some point in our lives, we all will have to make a decision on when or how to take care of our aging parents. Some people throw them into a retirement home and let them die. Others will keep their parents close by and check up on them, while some will just not give a flying fuck and maybe even hope they die faster (Some people actually posted this on RS so I'm not making this up.) There's no right way or wrong way - it's what you decide for yourself and your parents.

And managing life with no parents or support from friends? Well, again, that's something you need to figure out yourself and weigh out the pros and cons. I often wonder how my parents raised me and my siblings with no help, they were okay. Sure, they aren't as well off as others but it was a conscious sacrifice they made to give us a better life, for better or worse, and they they live humble, but happy lives and have no regrets. They don't let their sorrows and misfortunes be the crutch in how they live; They look forward to the future and what fruits it may bear, and that's how they've managed to come this far.

Yeah my parents were definitely not the happiest to find out that I was moving halfway around the world :badpokerface: but they kind of accepted it. I'm fortunate enough to have a few good friends around the Tokyo area, mostly from school who were either Japanese to begin with, or studied Japanese and were able to find employment there and are now living there long-term.

tl;dr version
- rich people do put in a lot of hours/make a lot of sacrifices, 100% in agreement with you.
- I'm trying to figure out if I NEED to experience that kind of work-your-socks-off kind of environment
- if money were not object, would people still choose to leave Vancouver?
- where's that happy medium between having 2 hours of work a day, and 2 hours of free time a day?

Since we already derailed the speak it out thread the past page or so, might as well keep the trend lol.

End of the day, there's really no one place that will meet everyone's needs to be honest. Same can be said about a company, always going to be pros/cons as ideal perfect world doesn't exist. The examples above such as chill/retirement city, caring for parents, someone to help watch over kids, there's always going to be some sacrifice that will be made to attain whatever goal you want to achieve and that's for your own self to decide. I feel a lot of young people graduate from school and expect to be making like say $30/hr off the bat and when they can only get a $20/hr job, they lose patient as they want instant gratification (millennial don't got time waiting lol). I've worked with people that start off as junior working for 2 years and they expect to be promoted to senior after that.

Back to me personally, don't have career struggles at the moment, more like wanting to find someone to settle down. Already coming close to mid 30's (not quite there yet, getting close).

Yeah I think there is a very deep connection between work and relationships. For instance, mom actually tells me she feels like her work is more of her family than her own family because of the sheer volume of hours she spends there. She forgot how old I was when I last asked her, but remembers how old her coworkers are FailFish

Sometimes though, I feel like work-talk really is a defense mechanism for deeper psychological issues. For me personally, I always attribute my stressors to work (which may actually be the case), but sometimes there are other things going on too and it would be unfair to blame it all on work.

ok sorry lets get this back on track

lets come back to talking about how single you guys are and how miserable you all are because the girl you are interested in doesn't like cars haha

I similarly feel like we all have different career goals as well and have to weigh out the pros and cons. One of my friends who grew up dirt-poor (literally), immigrated to Canada for a better life. Fast-track many years lateer, and he's in a pretty comfortable position now working in healthcare making $200,000 per year.

For me, I grew up with my mom driving me to school, paying for piano lessons, summer camps, sports. I wouldn't say we were filthy rich, but there was never a struggle. Which is why I've never been hungry for money.

My career goals are oriented more towards getting a leadership position within a company (higher salary or not), because growing up, I felt like I never really got the chance to take part in things like student council, etc (I was always busy with other activities). Only in the past few years have I really made the effort to try and volunteer more with things like helping run meetings, setup social events, prepare workshops - things that get me closer towards my goals.

Sure, I might not end up making nearly as much as my parents did or do, but I will have surpassed them in areas they never could have.

Euro7r - Post pics of the girls you want and let us judge and dictate who yo ushould chase after

c'mon the clock is ticking here!