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09-16-2010, 08:36 AM
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#1 | | Diagonally parked in a parallel universe
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| BC Conservative Party?
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-col...party-hst.html
With the whole down with the liberals fever, the BC Conservative party appears to be making a very well timed come back with some major players in their court. I wouldn't be suprized if eventually some of the Vanderzam/Ant-HST major players joined the party soon as well.
It got me thinking though about the lack of representation of a great deal of political views in this province. Personally I'm fairly liberal (as in slightly left of center not as in the party). But my choices here are a "Liberal" party that really is very far right leaning rather then representing an actual liberal perspective and has proven very untrustworthy, or an NDP party that's extreme left with no track record for fiscal responsibility. Alternately I could support the Green party who I desperately wish would take a page from their federal counter parts and take a social AND economic sustainability approach but currently come off as unorginized hippies. Who is there for me to vote for?
Now in comes the Conservative party. Will the provide an actual, viable alternative to the Liberal party? Or will they just serve to split up the vote more between themselves and the NDP and ensure the Liberals get re-elected?
Any thoughts?
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09-16-2010, 09:06 AM
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#2 | | Banned (ABWS)
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I think it'll split the vote with the Liberals, giving the NDP a win.
There are many right-leaning Liberals who do not currently like the Liberals and want an alternative that is not the tax and spend badly NDP.
A political forum in VLS would be a much better spot for discussions like this.
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09-16-2010, 09:18 AM
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#3 | | Diagonally parked in a parallel universe
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Originally Posted by taylor192  I think it'll split the vote with the Liberals, giving the NDP a win.
There are many right-leaning Liberals who do not currently like the Liberals and want an alternative that is not the tax and spend badly NDP.
A political forum in VLS would be a much better spot for discussions like this. |
Do we have one? I didn't see one. If we do, mods please move me!
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09-16-2010, 12:00 PM
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#4 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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Truth be told some of taylor's arguments r quite well executed. It's always good to have an opinion.
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09-16-2010, 12:06 PM
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#5 | | Banned (ABWS)
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Originally Posted by MajinHurricane we don't need another forum so we can hear taylor192 talk to himself. | Stay on topic. I'm sick of being given infractions for replying to insulting members. The only option I have is to report.
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09-16-2010, 12:15 PM
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#6 | | Banned (ABWS)
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| Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNewGirl Do we have one? I didn't see one. If we do, mods please move me! | No, we don't have one, yet it would be a great idea. The content in the VLS forums seems to stay on topic and offer more educated/intelligent opinions than the catch-all Off-Topic forum.
I think politically the Liberals did the right thing to send it to a referendum. Yes people can get behind a petition and blindly sign their name, yet a vote means putting more effort in to actually say "I don't like the Liberals, I will vote NDP" which many people who remember the last NDP government will never do.
Watch for the advertising ahead of the HST referendum, my guess it'll be negatively slanted warning that a vote against the HST is a vote for the NDP.
Last edited by taylor192; 09-16-2010 at 01:55 PM.
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09-16-2010, 12:31 PM
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#7 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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"Until the 1950s, the Conservatives dominated B.C. politics but eventually lost support to the Liberals, and then to the Social Credit party. The party has undergone many changes and has not held a seat since an NDP member of the legislature crossed the floor to sit for the party in 1986."
AHAHAHAHA, I love how they put that.
I'm voting Liberal again unless I see something really convincing around election time from another party. Something not based on HST, because it's not an important issue to me.
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Originally Posted by MajinHurricane who would ban me? lol. Look at my post count. | | |
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09-16-2010, 01:04 PM
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#8 | | reads most threads with his pants around his ankles, especially in the Forced Induction forum.
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Very gov is out there to get $$$ from your pockets and put it in their own. Just which one have to heart to take less.
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09-16-2010, 01:06 PM
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#9 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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I dun really see the point in voting against HST. For the most part it shifts the tax burden to spenders. I know TheNewGirl will disagree because of the whole issue of being taxed more on child care. But at the same time, it gives people a choice. If you don't like to pay taxes, don't buy on luxury items. The HST is revenue neutral blah blah blah, but whether the govt is lying or not, we now have a lower income tax. I'd rather have a lower income tax than a lower sales tax because if u wanna play, u've gotta pay. If u dun play, then u dun have to pay. I think this is more fair than everybody paying.
Another issue is the money that will be needed to reverse back to GST/PST. Who's gonna pay for all that? Us.
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09-16-2010, 01:08 PM
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#10 | | I only answer to my username, my real name is Irrelevant!
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its suspected that vander zalm is gonna lead the conservative party again come the next election
at this time though their support is very low(10's%) and the NDPs is higher than the Liberals (40 something % whereas Liberals are in the 30% or thereabouts)
that's a pretty defeatist attitude there q0192837465 (god your name sucks)
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09-16-2010, 01:28 PM
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#11 | | Banned (ABWS)
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Originally Posted by StylinRed its suspected that vander zalm is gonna lead the conservative party again come the next election | Lets hope not.
Last edited by taylor192; 09-16-2010 at 01:52 PM.
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09-16-2010, 01:36 PM
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#12 | | Banned By Establishment
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how can you not remember fantasy gardens?
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09-16-2010, 01:38 PM
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#13 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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Wasn't Zalm is disgraced leader who had to resign. I dunno guys, I definitely dun feel like voting for someone who has a bad record.
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09-16-2010, 01:54 PM
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#14 | | Banned (ABWS)
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Originally Posted by q0192837465 Wasn't Zalm is disgraced leader who had to resign. I dunno guys, I definitely dun feel like voting for someone who has a bad record. | Yep: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Vander_Zalm
Wow, I wonder if the HST supporters know half of this.
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09-16-2010, 02:16 PM
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#15 | | DOES HE LOOK LIKE A BITCH?
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Truth be told, I really don't give two shits about political factions. As long as they advocate something I like, they get my vote, because the results usually mean the winning party will eventually fuck up anyways.
Fail me if you want, but I have no faith in a Canadian system that's so soft.
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09-16-2010, 02:30 PM
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#16 | | Willing to sell body for a few minutes on RS
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Originally Posted by StylinRed its suspected that vander zalm is gonna lead the conservative party again come the next election
at this time though their support is very low(10's%) and the NDPs is higher than the Liberals (40 something % whereas Liberals are in the 30% or thereabouts)
that's a pretty defeatist attitude there q0192837465 (god your name sucks) | Wait, you mean he may have been using the HST crusade as a spring board to get back into politics? I'm not a big fan of the way the HST was brought it, pretty two faced and dishonest. It does not come as any surprise though if Vander Zalm gets back into politics, guaranteed this was the plan right from the get go of trying to repeal the HST. My dad and I actually had this same conversation when he started making headlines, oh look Vander Zalm getting his name out there you know he's coming back. I don't even have a problem with him getting back in. What I do have a problem with is his thinking that we're to stupid to realize this was the plan from day one.
The big problem is politicians in general take our complacency and mistake it for stupidity. I'd like to think most people are smart enough to realize what is really going on. It's just to bad more people don't vote and make their voice heard.
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09-16-2010, 02:46 PM
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#17 | | I Wanna Go Fast!
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Originally Posted by quasi The big problem is politicians in general take our complacency and mistake it for stupidity. I'd like to think most people are smart enough to realize what is really going on. It's just to bad more people don't vote and make their voice heard. | Canada needs to adopt Australia's policy that voting is required by law.
We need their immigration policies too as far as I'm concerned but that's another thread entirely.
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09-16-2010, 02:57 PM
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#18 | | Diagonally parked in a parallel universe
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Originally Posted by q0192837465 I dun really see the point in voting against HST. For the most part it shifts the tax burden to spenders. I know TheNewGirl will disagree because of the whole issue of being taxed more on child care. But at the same time, it gives people a choice. If you don't like to pay taxes, don't buy on luxury items. The HST is revenue neutral blah blah blah, but whether the govt is lying or not, we now have a lower income tax. I'd rather have a lower income tax than a lower sales tax because if u wanna play, u've gotta pay. If u dun play, then u dun have to pay. I think this is more fair than everybody paying.
Another issue is the money that will be needed to reverse back to GST/PST. Who's gonna pay for all that? Us. | Lowered income tax actually hampers stimulus efforts and most of the economic experts say that we would be better off increasing income tax for the top tax brackets.
That said if the people of BC vote to keep the HST I'll accept that and stop bitching about it  .
I think that Gordo went with the referendum cause his own party members were saying they wouldn't come to the legislation to vote in support of the HST so he knew it would gets struck down there and this is the only way he can buy time until it's all someone else's problem rather then his own.
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09-16-2010, 02:59 PM
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#19 | | Diagonally parked in a parallel universe
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Originally Posted by taylor192 | Ohhhh trust me, I wouldn't vote for Vander Zalm either.
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09-16-2010, 03:44 PM
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#20 | | DOES HE LOOK LIKE A BITCH?
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Originally Posted by JDął Canada needs to adopt Australia's policy that voting is required by law.
We need their immigration policies too as far as I'm concerned but that's another thread entirely. | You make it sound as if compulsory voting makes everything better.
It's not as if it'll lure the educated, truly opinionated people out from hiding to vote.
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09-16-2010, 03:50 PM
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#21 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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Originally Posted by TheNewGirl Lowered income tax actually hampers stimulus efforts and most of the economic experts say that we would be better off increasing income tax for the top tax brackets.
That said if the people of BC vote to keep the HST I'll accept that and stop bitching about it .
I think that Gordo went with the referendum cause his own party members were saying they wouldn't come to the legislation to vote in support of the HST so he knew it would gets struck down there and this is the only way he can buy time until it's all someone else's problem rather then his own. | I dun see how increasing income tax can help stimulate the economy when disposable income is reduced.
By the time of the referendum, I'm sure most people who went apeshit over HST r cooled down and accept the fact that it's part of their lives. The way I see it is that ppl r generally reluctant to change. That's why ppl see HST as an evil beast. When things r settled, ppl dun want tio change again and will start saying how HST somehow improved their lives. I highly doubt the sentiment towards HST can last till the time of the referendum. By then ppl will find something else to hate.
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09-16-2010, 04:12 PM
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#22 | | I Wanna Go Fast!
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Originally Posted by Culture_Vulture You make it sound as if compulsory voting makes everything better.
It's not as if it'll lure the educated, truly opinionated people out from hiding to vote. | Yes it will, because in Australia it's a serious offense not to vote. It also makes it so that whoever is in power actually has the true majority of the vote, they represent what the population wants because EVERYONE had their say. They don't just get in because they were the "best option" and 50% of the eligible voters didn't care enough to do so - like Canada.
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09-16-2010, 05:14 PM
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#23 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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^ Everyone does get their say though. 50% just opt to vote "don't care"
I agree mandatory voting would produce better results though
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Originally Posted by MajinHurricane who would ban me? lol. Look at my post count. | | |
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09-16-2010, 06:21 PM
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#24 | | HELP ME PLS!!!
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Originally Posted by JDął Yes it will, because in Australia it's a serious offense not to vote. It also makes it so that whoever is in power actually has the true majority of the vote, they represent what the population wants because EVERYONE had their say. They don't just get in because they were the "best option" and 50% of the eligible voters didn't care enough to do so - like Canada. | no it won't. it'll just make people who care nothing about politics just pissed off more, and vote for more fringe parties/spoil their ballots. the people who want to vote, will, and the people who don't want to, won't.
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09-16-2010, 06:25 PM
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#25 | | HELP ME PLS!!!
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btw we had a politics section at one time .. i remember quite well seeing johnny get flamed non stop in it :P
anyways whats truly sad is people who will vote for ndp cuz they don't like paying more tax ... yet they don't realize that with the ndp, they'll end up paying infinitely more money for much much less.
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