The Official No Need To Start a New Thread, Thread

[SSM_DC5]

So how many lollipops and taco from the management did you need to eat to get to where you are?

[whitev70r]

Oh man ... that's the shittiest system of work ever. The system is going to implode. You got top guys (pilots) making so much and the guys on the lowest on the totem pole constantly eating poop. Then when the guys who had to pay their dues get to the top, they will make sure all the newbs eat shit because they had to. But hey, if you only have a high school diploma.

[MarkyMark]

Originally Posted by whitev70r

Oh man ... that's the shittiest system of work ever. The system is going to implode. You got top guys (pilots) making so much and the guys on the lowest on the totem pole constantly eating poop. Then when the guys who had to pay their dues get to the top, they will make sure all the newbs eat shit because they had to. But hey, if you only have a high school diploma.

The funny part was during Covid they implemented a system where you could do it all online instead of hundreds of people driving from wherever they live to Surrey crammed into a hall, and then they just abandoned it after and made everyone come back to the old way because fuck progress lol

[bcedhk]

Anyone seeing the cringe worthy Instagram ad from Infiniti Canada lately?

It’s with some socially awkward photographer taking random photos of the car. It doesn’t even say which model or make… whoever is in their marketing team needs to get fired

[underscore]

Originally Posted by Tapioca

The mall crawler scene is huge, based on the price of older Jeep models and 4Runners.

Fixed that for you. Most of those guys never go offroad, or at best they do FSRs that people drive minivans down.

[Badhobz]

Originally Posted by SSM_DC5

So how many lollipops and taco from the management did you need to eat to get to where you are?

None. I am management. I came from CN into my current gig.

All my shit eating happened when I was in CN. Jumping from a conductor (union) to CN management meant I lost a lot of friends. But I didn’t have to work in the rain anymore and potentially lose my leg slipping on box car rungs

[Badhobz]

Originally Posted by whitev70r

Oh man ... that's the shittiest system of work ever. The system is going to implode. You got top guys (pilots) making so much and the guys on the lowest on the totem pole constantly eating poop. Then when the guys who had to pay their dues get to the top, they will make sure all the newbs eat shit because they had to. But hey, if you only have a high school diploma.

Pilots are in their own union. Different than longshore.
For longshore the best position / king of the job board are the linesmen.

These guys are the dudes who tie up the ships / release the mooring lines.
Why? Because each tie up or release only takes 40 minutes and it counts as a shift. If there’s a lot of vessels that day you can get in 2 shifts a day for less than 2 hours of work.

Worst job is lashers. They are the manual labor that binds/unbind those metal bars to the containers. It’s physical, it’s dangerous, and it’s quite stressful. Everyone starts as lashers and then afterwards go into mechanized equipment.

[Traum]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

All my shit eating happened when I was in CN. Jumping from a conductor (union) to CN management meant I lost a lot of friends. But I didn’t have to work in the rain anymore and potentially lose my leg slipping on box car rungs

If these people stopped being friends with you just bcos you went on to become management, they were never your friends to begin with.

[noclue]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

Pilots are in their own union. Different than longshore.
For longshore the best position / king of the job board are the linesmen.

These guys are the dudes who tie up the ships / release the mooring lines.
Why? Because each tie up or release only takes 40 minutes and it counts as a shift. If there’s a lot of vessels that day you can get in 2 shifts a day for less than 2 hours of work.

Worst job is lashers. They are the manual labor that binds/unbind those metal bars to the containers. It’s physical, it’s dangerous, and it’s quite stressful. Everyone starts as lashers and then afterwards go into mechanized equipment.

What kind of automation will help the port but the union is opposed to?

[Badhobz]

Originally Posted by noclue

What kind of automation will help the port but the union is opposed to?

Any and all kinds.

For example Deltaport had some new cantilever rail mounted gantry cranes. That was key part of their Deltaport densification project (drep). Union fought them tooth and nail until they promised that all existing crane drivers jobs will be protected and it won’t lead to any job cuts.

With this new system it’s pretty much automatic. The computer does 99 percent of the work and the operator sits inside a air conditioned room press a single button to confirm the move. They can go into manual mode but why bother. Of course the next step is to remove the human element.

If you look at other international port terminals they are also fully automated. There’s no longshore on the berth almost. The union fears this of course but how long can they strangle hold progress is up to the politicians.

Average North American moves per hour are at 27-30. Average Asia moves are well exceeding 35+. Automation and lack of these unions yields much bigger productivity gains. Deltaport barely can crack 24 so even below North American standards.

[MarkyMark]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

Any and all kinds.

For example Deltaport had some new cantilever rail mounted gantry cranes. That was key part of their Deltaport densification project (drep). Union fought them tooth and nail until they promised that all existing crane drivers jobs will be protected and it won’t lead to any job cuts.

With this new system it’s pretty much automatic. The computer does 99 percent of the work and the operator sits inside a air conditioned room press a single button to confirm the move. They can go into manual mode but why bother. Of course the next step is to remove the human element.

If you look at other international port terminals they are also fully automated. There’s no longshore on the berth almost. The union fears this of course but how long can they strangle hold progress is up to the politicians.

Average North American moves per hour are at 27-30. Average Asia moves are well exceeding 35+. Automation and lack of these unions yields much bigger productivity gains. Deltaport barely can crack 24 so even below North American standards.

I imagine if RBT2 gets built we'll see how many longshoremen a port actually needs since it'll be built with automation in mind

[Badhobz]

I doubt the union will let it automate to any extent. RB2 is my pet project and the biggest headache for me.

[bcrdukes]

Damn Asians

Edit: I meant in terms of how impressive their efficiencies are…

[MarkyMark]

Does the union actually have a say in how a new terminal is built?

[Badhobz]

yeah of course, otherwise they would just picket westshore / deltaport and we cant even break ground. You cannot disinvolve them in the process because of past precedent of the waterfront. Its their job historically.

Sometimes dont you just wish for the efficiency of communist/fascist china?
https://vancouver.citynews.ca/2022/0...failing-grade/

"Out of 370 ports, Vancouver ranked 368th in the World Bank Group Container Port Performance Index 2021. Saudi Arabia’s King Abdullah Port took first place, while the Port of Los Angeles took last."

So awesome!!! when i go to these international conferences i usually say im from a port in China. Im too embarrassed to say im from vancouver.

[whitev70r]

Yah, I'm failing to see the logic of how workers can dictate to company that they can't mechanize or automate with cranes etc. I get the 'oh we're going to lose jobs' sentiment but at the end of the day, it's a business. What if the auto industry still build cars one by one with hands instead of assembly line ??!!

[Badhobz]

Logic and common sense has no place on the waterfront.

But that’s the hands we are dealt. The only thing that’ll change mindsets is if it turns into a situation like Portland where they used to have a thriving container terminal but due to how militant their union was, it drove away all the business. Eventually they just shut it down.

https://www.oregonlive.com/business/...outputType=amp

[donk.]

Next taxi - Uber scenario, is the ports by the sounds of it

The real question is, at what year do all jobs get "re-written" by automation

[yray]

best gig is cruise terminal longshoreman

[Badhobz]

Yeh it’s funny watching these Americans tip these longshoremen who are making 150-200k a year. Luckily it’s a seasonal gig but it’s highly coveted and when the cruise ships are in town we usually lose labor gangs on the terminals.

[Traum]

The difference between the US west coast vs the Canadian west coast is though -- the US west coast stretches from Blaine, WA all the way to Imperial Beach, CA, and any given city with a big enough port can take the business of another port. But here in BC, we pretty much only have Vancouver that can meaningfully serve as the gateway to the rest of Canada on the West Coast.

(Or we can just have our ports shut down, and have stuff shipped up from the US~ yay~)

Originally Posted by Badhobz

Logic and common sense has no place on the waterfront.

But that’s the hands we are dealt. The only thing that’ll change mindsets is if it turns into a situation like Portland where they used to have a thriving container terminal but due to how militant their union was, it drove away all the business. Eventually they just shut it down.

https://www.oregonlive.com/business/...outputType=amp

[Badhobz]

So all the stuff that goes through our gateway, 70% is USA destined anyways (Canada isn’t a huge import market vs the USA). Besides Vancouver there’s also prince rupert (same ILWU) but longer travel times to east coast than Vancouver traditionally.

The only thing keeping our asses in game is the dollar advantage. That’s the only reason why people are shipping through Canada instead of going through the USA directly. Recently with the bullshit China vs Canada crap, Asian companies are instead going through their belt and road countries to Europe and then finally to east coast of USA instead of west coast. The east coast longshoremen union ILA is way easier to deal with.

Only port worse performing than Vancouver is LA Longbeach and people are sick of dealing with these restrictions.

[whitev70r]

^ Badhobz ... your intel on this particular area is shining through. And all along, I thought you were just some old Asian gizzard living with white man dick energy envy.

[bcrdukes]

Originally Posted by whitev70r

^ Badhobz ... your intel on this particular area is shining through. And all along, I thought you were just some old Asian gizzard living with white man dick energy envy.

This made my day. Would thank you more than once if I could.

[Badhobz]

who says im not?