The Official No Need To Start a New Thread, Thread

[Hondaracer]

G35 had its time and lasted longer than most of that generation although you don’t see them to often anymore

G37 coupe is a great looking car and continues to be imo

[supafamous]

Q: What some white collar jobs that are well paying, relatively low stress and low social interaction? Strong preference towards remote work.

Some of you may recall that I suffered an illness earlier this year where I lost a lot of my hearing - enough that I'm medically classified as having severe loss. It's been a really hard, life altering change and I've made the decision to step down from my current tech exec job (at a small company) to look after my health.

I'm financially secure enough that I only need to work a few more years and make another $500-600k during those years before retirement so I'm hoping to step down into something that pays around $125-175k (my line of work is product management) but I want to consider other options but I really don't know if there's anything outside of my line of work that I could easily step into. I'm considering advising, consulting, and coaching but that's all still in the tech space.

Is there anything else I should be thinking about?

Edit: I should acknowledge that I'm very lucky that I can afford to make such a choice and not just have to tough it out and that it probably sounds really privileged to say I'm looking to step DOWN to a job that pays $125-175k.

[Badhobz]

i dont know squat about tech, but it seems like most people in the tech field are pretty stressed out. Ive never seen a "low stress" tech job, and everyone who is in tech looks like they are a few more QA audits away from going postal

If you only need to work a few more years, just do some day trading and take the opportunity to enjoy life. Cut down a bit on expenses and you should be able to manage without stepping back into the stupid grind.

or flip a 180 and go sell cars like dark082114342341534234242. Try something outside your wheelhouse and see if you like it. Might as well.
Go start a business maybe? you can get your realtor license and go sell RS members houses/condoms. YES COMDOMS

Im thinking about retiring in 10 years too (when i turn 50). I dont really need the money, or the hassle of doing "port" related crap. I also have no desire to advance my career cuz frankly i dont give a shit. Ohhh i can be the VP of port operations, yah yah yah who cares. I dont want to give speeches to the public where i accidentally might slip up and call someone a retarded fag.

[sonick]

Advising, coaching and consulting is pretty high on the social interaction scale. Also given how much engagement it requires I do t really see how it can be done effectively if you're hard of hearing.

Lastly, I assume you would branch out on your own to be an advisor/coach/consultant, which although being an entrepreneur may be flexible, it is also the most extreme level of stress and risk (but also the biggest potential for reward).

[Hondaracer]

Don’t see many people outside of experts in their field who are going to be working remotely and making 125-175k

At that point you’re likely either customer facing in a consultant or PM role, or you’re in management, which, both don’t sound suitable for you

[whitev70r]

New Post function working like it used to now ... no going back to wait 10 seconds!
Thanks, what was the fix?

[Traum]

Originally Posted by whitev70r

New Post function working like it used to now ... no going back to wait 10 seconds!
Thanks, what was the fix?

And I thought it was just me or my stupid Chrome. But even during the time when it wasn't working properly, the New Post link would still act fine if I opened the link in a new tab.

As to supafamous question, have you considered some sort of IT management position in the public sector? It would check the salary, low(er) stress, and partial remote work boxes. In theory, there'd probably be a pension as well, but you'd have to work long enough -- probably 2 to 3+ years of full time work? -- before you qualify to receive pension, and the actual pension amount would be pretty miniscule anyway.

This sort of public sector tech jobs generally have a hard time hiring candidates because their pay sucks compared to the private sector.

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by supafamous

Q: What some white collar jobs that are well paying, relatively low stress and low social interaction? Strong preference towards remote work.

Some of you may recall that I suffered an illness earlier this year where I lost a lot of my hearing - enough that I'm medically classified as having severe loss. It's been a really hard, life altering change and I've made the decision to step down from my current tech exec job (at a small company) to look after my health.

I'm financially secure enough that I only need to work a few more years and make another $500-600k during those years before retirement so I'm hoping to step down into something that pays around $125-175k (my line of work is product management) but I want to consider other options but I really don't know if there's anything outside of my line of work that I could easily step into. I'm considering advising, consulting, and coaching but that's all still in the tech space.

Is there anything else I should be thinking about?

Edit: I should acknowledge that I'm very lucky that I can afford to make such a choice and not just have to tough it out and that it probably sounds really privileged to say I'm looking to step DOWN to a job that pays $125-175k.

What are the checkboxes you are looking for in a new job?

It sounds like you might be looking for a job to try and minimize interactions (meetings, collab work, etc) and maximize heads down work so your hearing loss so as to more easily get used to your new normal?

I struggle to think of much that would pay 125+ that wouldn't require a healthy about of collab work as at that point, your expertise is where the value is and you'll need to communicate with others to have your knowledge received.

[RabidRat]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

If you only need to work a few more years, just do some day trading and take the opportunity to enjoy life. Cut down a bit on expenses and you should be able to manage without stepping back into the stupid grind.

[...]

Go start a business maybe?

I dunno, I think the stats are pretty terrible on day trading and entrepreneurship. Could set him back even more.

Maybe riffing on that though, take over an existing business where they've absorbed all the risk for you already? I'm projecting here, but maybe running a neighborhood specialty coffee place might be a good semi-retirement.

You wouldn't want to actually completely cut yourself off socially, even if it is a lot more tiring than it used to be: I think that's how you get Alzheimers. I read somewhere that folks who lose their hearing are at way higher risk of developing dementia, because they lose the cognitive stimulation of continual social interaction.

Originally Posted by Badhobz

I dont want to give speeches to the public where i accidentally might slip up and call someone a retarded fag.

I think the accidental slip up might be that you didn't call someone a retarded fag.

Originally Posted by Traum

, have you considered some sort of IT management position in the public sector?

This sort of public sector tech jobs generally have a hard time hiring candidates because their pay sucks compared to the private sector.

+1 on this one!

Also I don't think the pay is that bad. My wife works in government and she's within the range that Supa wants to step down into. Either a senior individual contributor or entry management role would get you into [the lower part of] that range. And comes with the pension etc, as you mentioned.

[supafamous]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

If you only need to work a few more years, just do some day trading and take the opportunity to enjoy life. Cut down a bit on expenses and you should be able to manage without stepping back into the stupid grind.

A couple of my tech friends and I semi-joke about getting a job at Costco stocking shelves. No one to bother you, good benefits, etc. That one day is what I figure I'll do to keep myself active. I don't need to make $125k+ - that's just a number that leaves me living very comfortably so it's an option to go further down (I just need cashflow for the next few years).

Originally Posted by sonick

Advising, coaching and consulting is pretty high on the social interaction scale. Also given how much engagement it requires I do t really see how it can be done effectively if you're hard of hearing.

Lastly, I assume you would branch out on your own to be an advisor/coach/consultant, which although being an entrepreneur may be flexible, it is also the most extreme level of stress and risk (but also the biggest potential for reward).

Fair point - some aspects of this I find just fine for me. Basically the stuff that is tough for me are the high stakes conversations where many people are speaking (like a weekly exec meeting) or 1:1 meetings with my directs but stuff like 3rd party coaching (someone who doesn't report to me) is generally pretty easy and enjoyable for me. In my line of work I'd probably charge $200-300/hr as well so, in theory, I could have two hours of calls a day and make a pretty solid living.

Originally Posted by Traum

As to supafamous question, have you considered some sort of IT management position in the public sector? It would check the salary, low(er) stress, and partial remote work boxes. In theory, there'd probably be a pension as well, but you'd have to work long enough -- probably 2 to 3+ years of full time work? -- before you qualify to receive pension, and the actual pension amount would be pretty miniscule anyway.

This sort of public sector tech jobs generally have a hard time hiring candidates because their pay sucks compared to the private sector.

yeah, I'll have to look into it - I know someone in my line of work who works for the provincial gov't who seems to enjoy it. I could do this kind of job in my sleep. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Badhobz]

yah go work at costco. ill join you!

but I refuse to deal with the customers so ill work the late shift restocking shit or something.

I swear to god if I have to talk to a Chinese ah mo about fucking eggs or something, I'm going to throw that bitch into the chicken roaster.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by supafamous

Q: What some white collar jobs that are well paying, relatively low stress and low social interaction? Strong preference towards remote work.

Some of you may recall that I suffered an illness earlier this year where I lost a lot of my hearing - enough that I'm medically classified as having severe loss. It's been a really hard, life altering change and I've made the decision to step down from my current tech exec job (at a small company) to look after my health.

I'm financially secure enough that I only need to work a few more years and make another $500-600k during those years before retirement so I'm hoping to step down into something that pays around $125-175k (my line of work is product management) but I want to consider other options but I really don't know if there's anything outside of my line of work that I could easily step into. I'm considering advising, consulting, and coaching but that's all still in the tech space.

Is there anything else I should be thinking about?

Edit: I should acknowledge that I'm very lucky that I can afford to make such a choice and not just have to tough it out and that it probably sounds really privileged to say I'm looking to step DOWN to a job that pays $125-175k.

Have you considered joining a startup either as a strict equity-compensated advisor or maybe start your business?

This is more or less what I'm doing right now.

My income is fairly stagnant now. More or less related to the general macro-economic environment and industry shift in the business I'm in (CRE). I'm not really worried about money to bring food to the table and buy toys. But I also see almost impossible for me to reach a next level in term of income without waiting it out if I stay put. And with the fact that I plan to retire after kids are done college, I don't really have a lot of time to ride the economic cycles (probably another 1 or 2) to boost my income.

So, I'm planning to partner with people who I know work hard (like born serial-entrepreneur who can't stay put for even a few month) and develop some stable, but often overlooked foreign markets.

[underscore]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

but I refuse to deal with the customers so ill work the late shift restocking shit or something.

Doing late shift stocking at London Drugs was the chillest job I ever had, the only crappy part was when they'd play Christmas music.

[supafamous]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

What are the checkboxes you are looking for in a new job?

It sounds like you might be looking for a job to try and minimize interactions (meetings, collab work, etc) and maximize heads down work so your hearing loss so as to more easily get used to your new normal?

I struggle to think of much that would pay 125+ that wouldn't require a healthy about of collab work as at that point, your expertise is where the value is and you'll need to communicate with others to have your knowledge received.

I think the priority checkbox for any job is great work-life balance and lower end stress. I don't mind collaboration and meetings - I just need to turn them into lower stress meetings - I've been in a leadership/management role (either reporting to the CEO or 1 degree away) since 2009 so just dropping people management and exec meetings is a big reduction in stress. The work that my direct reports do, while stressful to them, is easy street for me so some of this is relative. That said, less meetings and less collaboration, would be good - the job would be even easier for me if most of my day is heads down time (or async time - like working over Slack, reviewing docs etc).

Edit: I also want to minimise work travel - this is more to do with me just loving being a parent and that I hate being away from my kid and less to do with my hearing issues (though it's a factor).

Originally Posted by Hehe

Have you considered joining a startup either as a strict equity-compensated advisor or maybe start your business?

Being an equity comped advisor is something that I had on my list as a down the road thing (like 7-8 years from now) - I would have wanted a stronger resume (that's gone up in smoke now) to do that.

Starting my business - I'd only do it if I thought I could build a successful and stable coaching business. I've dabbled by offering my time in exchange for donations and was pretty successful in getting interest so it's something to explore - I have decent reach here, I regularly have strangers reach out to me saying that they were told to come talk to me but I don't know if I can make enough money with it.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by supafamous

Being an equity comped advisor is something that I had on my list as a down the road thing (like 7-8 years from now) - I would have wanted a stronger resume (that's gone up in smoke now) to do that.

Starting my business - I'd only do it if I thought I could build a successful and stable coaching business. I've dabbled by offering my time in exchange for donations and was pretty successful in getting interest so it's something to explore - I have decent reach here, I regularly have strangers reach out to me saying that they were told to come talk to me but I don't know if I can make enough money with it.

I think it all depends on what kind of return you are seeking and how comfortable you are.

I can see that you try to leverage as much as possible on your existing knowledge, but from my own experience, that might not always be the best use of resources. For example... many Youtubers started talking about topics they are familiar with. But ultimately shifted to topics that they are actually good at showing people.

In my case, I'm now venturing into a business that has little to do with what my knowledge can really offer. However, I know the people I'm working with and the numbers are quite solid.

Basically we are investing in chunks of few hundred G a piece with the expected recovery at around 6-12mths. The idea is then invest in more chunks and live off the cashflow once the initial craze subsides.

Ultimately, what I'm focusing here is cashflow. If I can achieve a stable say 50k (valued at today's money adjusted for inflation in the long term) a month at the time of my retirement in 10-15yrs... I think I will have just elevated myself into the next income bracket where instead of thinking buying Tesla as my next toy, I might be able to venture into buying Ferraris and Lambos.

[westopher]

Originally Posted by underscore

Doing late shift stocking at London Drugs was the chillest job I ever had, the only crappy part was when they'd play Christmas music.

He's all good because he won't be able to hear it now.
Sorry to read about your health issues supa, rabid rat said it well though, being a little too far on the isolation scale can be very bad for cognitive health.
That said, communication can be through writing in a role like that, can it not? I really don't know about the tech industry though.
Is the choice to leave due to a discomfort caused by this new issue? Because I'm sure doing what you do, your skills to adapt to issues are probably well beyond the average person.

[supafamous]

Originally Posted by RabidRat

Maybe riffing on that though, take over an existing business where they've absorbed all the risk for you already? I'm projecting here, but maybe running a neighborhood specialty coffee place might be a good semi-retirement.

Hadn't considered that though it seems like it'd be a lot of work but maybe it'd be rewarding.

Originally Posted by RabidRat

You wouldn't want to actually completely cut yourself off socially, even if it is a lot more tiring than it used to be: I think that's how you get Alzheimers. I read somewhere that folks who lose their hearing are at way higher risk of developing dementia, because they lose the cognitive stimulation of continual social interaction.

Totally, my odds of dementia are significantly higher now than before but staying active and social help a lot. My hearing aids also help as well - it's just that it can actually too much stimuli. Most of the time the hearing aids do their job well but there's stuff where it can only help so much - like if I'm not looking at you and focused on what you're saying I kinda can't understand you or I'm no good at telling the direction of a sound anymore. The acoustics of a room can make a big difference for me - hard surfaces and sharp edges make things a lot harder to hear.

Originally Posted by westopher

That said, communication can be through writing in a role like that, can it not? I really don't know about the tech industry though.

Some companies are very async and writing heavy so those are ideal for me now but most are still very much about jumping on a call (1:1 or group).

Originally Posted by westopher

Is the choice to leave due to a discomfort caused by this new issue? Because I'm sure doing what you do, your skills to adapt to issues are probably well beyond the average person.

Yeah, it's that it's much more tiring to have to listen to people especially when you have to really focus/concentrate on what's being said (let's say we're having a debate on something). I turn on closed captioning on a lot of my calls now when I'm tired b/c it's just easier for me to read what they say than listen to what they say - it makes me slower to respond but it lets me manage my energy better.

It's sorta like how you have to really concentrate when someone speaks to you in a language that you don't speak well - I have to be locked in ALL the time in order for me to understand people. It can be really exhausting to do that for 8 hours of meetings.

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by supafamous

I think the priority checkbox for any job is great work-life balance and lower end stress. I don't mind collaboration and meetings - I just need to turn them into lower stress meetings - I've been in a leadership/management role (either reporting to the CEO or 1 degree away) since 2009 so just dropping people management and exec meetings is a big reduction in stress. The work that my direct reports do, while stressful to them, is easy street for me so some of this is relative. That said, less meetings and less collaboration, would be good - the job would be even easier for me if most of my day is heads down time (or async time - like working over Slack, reviewing docs etc).

Edit: I also want to minimise work travel - this is more to do with me just loving being a parent and that I hate being away from my kid and less to do with my hearing issues (though it's a factor).



Being an equity comped advisor is something that I had on my list as a down the road thing (like 7-8 years from now) - I would have wanted a stronger resume (that's gone up in smoke now) to do that.

Starting my business - I'd only do it if I thought I could build a successful and stable coaching business. I've dabbled by offering my time in exchange for donations and was pretty successful in getting interest so it's something to explore - I have decent reach here, I regularly have strangers reach out to me saying that they were told to come talk to me but I don't know if I can make enough money with it.

A senior product owner is going to net you 125-150k on the current market. The problem would be finding that job and then if they want to hire you, I can see them saying either you are over qualified and treat you as a flight risk, or they put you in the bucket of "has experience but hasn't done it for too long".

I'm not a fan of starting a business as the stress is not the same. A consultancy maybe, but getting that first 3 contracts is going to the hard part unless you already have an in.

[Badhobz]

well the only perk of hearing loss is you can turn annoying shit down with the hearing aid

HEY you fat fuck go take out the trash and go clean up the window and do this and that....

what what what? i cant hear squat. bai

[supafamous]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

A senior product owner is going to net you 125-150k on the current market. The problem would be finding that job and then if they want to hire you, I can see them saying either you are over qualified and treat you as a flight risk, or they put you in the bucket of "has experience but hasn't done it for too long".

I'm old enough (48) that ageism might even be a thing - do they let old people work in tech anymore? Don't they have to put me in a wood chipper?

By lucky circumstance (being shorthanded) the past 4-5 months I've had to roll up my sleeves and do individual contributor work and discovered/was reminded that I'm still effing great at it. It was definitely a factor in me feeling good about making the move but you're right in that this is definitely a risk.

Realistically if I can't go down the food chain enough then I'd go further up the food chain and look at the Staff/Principal PM roles - I don't really want that level of responsibility but at least I'm out of the people management/exec space and the money is great. I've seen folks like me transition to those roles pretty seamlessly.

[RabidRat]

That sounds pretty good too, and would let you get to retirement that much more quickly if you can just power through it.

We had a senior director of program management at work who - a couple of years ago - just say fk it, and went into some kind of super IC consultant role where he just seems to show up in random places at random times, every once in a while dropping a hot take. He seems to have fun with it.

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by supafamous

I'm old enough (48) that ageism might even be a thing - do they let old people work in tech anymore? Don't they have to put me in a wood chipper?

By lucky circumstance (being shorthanded) the past 4-5 months I've had to roll up my sleeves and do individual contributor work and discovered/was reminded that I'm still effing great at it. It was definitely a factor in me feeling good about making the move but you're right in that this is definitely a risk.

Realistically if I can't go down the food chain enough then I'd go further up the food chain and look at the Staff/Principal PM roles - I don't really want that level of responsibility but at least I'm out of the people management/exec space and the money is great. I've seen folks like me transition to those roles pretty seamlessly.

48 isn't a huge deal. Tech has been around long enough that age isn't a big deal anymore.

If you can show that you've done the work in the past bit it'll take you out of the "haven't done it for too long" bucket but still can't shed the flight risk profile.

A principle/staff role sounds great, until you run into a company that expects that role to be a lead as well. Too many places expect a principle role to do dual duty as IC and a people/tech leader.

At the end of the day, it doesn't cost you anything but some time to try interviewing. Who knows you might land something.

[underscore]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

well the only perk of hearing loss is you can turn annoying shit down with the hearing aid

HEY you fat fuck go take out the trash and go clean up the window and do this and that....

what what what? i cant hear squat. bai

One of my roommates in university had hearing aids controlled by a watch. If someone annoying was talking he'd pretend to check the time and turn them down lol.

[supafamous]

Thanks all for the thoughts and ideas around my question yesterday - I live in a bit of bubble as my social circle is nearly all tech folks and hearing different POVs is really great. Just talking it out was really helpful.

[68style]

My heart goes out to you for having this come into your life it sucks... and as someone of similar age (46) who is currently unemployed and, for the next bit not actively looking, it's interesting to read for when I do start looking in a month or 2.

I'm nowhere near the level of expertise and my highest salary was like not much more than half what you're looking for lol but still interesting to read about. Not sure where I will go next but after 20 years in fleet management maybe it should not involve cars anymore hahaha