What did you do to your vehicle today?

[320icar]

so ive been dabbling with some carbon fibre. i have pretty much zero experience so learning from scratch is hard. everything from choosing cloth, release agents, vacuum processes, what kind of resins, what style of which resin you chose etc. all of this tailored to the DIY in the garage that anyone could do.

done a couple end plates so far. ive learned a lot, but CF is expensive as all hell. makes learning it a bit difficult... but i am learning, so its not all wasted money right?

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

[hud 91gt]

Looks like an amazing finished product to me

[coneZONE]

You said learning? Looks like mastered to me

[320icar]

**edit** I’ll add photos shortly, going for dog walk

It’s all on the angle of the photo. I can give some point form of just “food for thought” of things I’ve learned. CF is carbon, FG fibre glass

- carbon fibre is expensive. 50” wide is $50/yard for your pretty standard 2x2 twill. Same size fibreglass cloth is about $10.
- CF normally used epoxy resin, it’s strong but for 1L costs about $65. FG normally uses polyester resin, which is about $18/L. Massive difference. I chose to run the cheaper poly resin since I’m just learning and I expect to make a lot of scrap material. Strength is correlated between the medium. Epoxy is like CF, poly is like FG.
- for resins there are waxed and unwaxed. It’s confusing but the easiest way to figure it out is, If you’re laminating multiple sheets or doing multiple pours, use unwaxed. If it’s a single coat. Or finishing top coat, or just a wet layup then waxed. Waxed means it air cures hard and without tack. But if you need to pour on top you must sand it down.
- a great budget setup is using the cheap vacuum storage bags from the dollar store meant for blankets etc and a shop vac. It’s just about the right amount of vacuum to conform the peel ply/bleeder cloth to the part, but not enough to pull resin out of the part. Bonus is the smell is kept in the bag and it’s not nearly as noxious.
- use more resin than you think. I was too concerned with getting the right ratio between cloth to resin for weight and strength, but that’s shooting for the stars. Mix more than you need and soak the shit out of your material. It’s better to waste $2 in resin than scrap $100 worth of cf because it didn’t saturate enough
- thinking ahead and prep-work is key. getting a quality finished product right the first time is way easier and cheaper than having to do a tonne of post work to make it passable.

My failures, there are lots.

- first flat plate I made. 8 layers CF, super strong and 2.3mm thick. Laid up on two pieces of glass with some mold release. I didn’t put enough resin down on the glass before my first layer of cf. it visually looked fully saturated but it wasn’t. Once I pulled the part, the surface finish was great but I wasn’t able to fully trace the parts I were planning on. Lesson learned, USE MORE RESIN. you can see from the photo that most the edges (easiest seen at 120'clock) did not get fully saturated. also, when trying to cut the cloth i heard of a tip online to just say use masking tape. i did, but i did not realize that YOU CANNOT PEEL THE TAPE OFF WITHOUT RUINING THE WEAVE!. so i just had to send it with the tape on. this is one of the reasons the edges didn't absorb resin. i also learned that pinching pennies by using as little cloth as possible is the wrong idea. yes its expensive, but just suck it up and use more material so you KNOW you can get your finished part out of it.

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

- second failure was another set of end plates. I couldn’t find a piece of glass or mirror the right size. Found a cheapo picture frame with a plastic front piece. Looked online and info said if you wax it, you can pull off of plastic no problem. WELL, I totally forgot I wasn’t using epoxy, I was using poly resin. Soooo the next day when I opened the vac bag, the sheet of plastic had melted with the texture of CF. Part was salvageable but surface finish was bunk. i did use the correct method for cutting straight lines though, you pull a strand out of the weave and it leaves a straight line through the entire cloth. cut and repeat! you can see the imprinted tecture on the plastic, which is pretty cool. i also need to learn to lay my weave down straighter. its sooo flexible im surprised. this was only 6 ply. still strong but i preferred the feeling of 8

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

- 3rd failure was I decided to skin the front of my second endplates. For some reason I had it in my head that I will use the vacuum setup again. So I laid a single sheet of cf on glass, soaked it, then laid my endplates on top and sealed it. WELL the pull was horrible. The resin never set properly because it’s unwaxed, and the resin that was suppose to glue to the endplate just pushed outwards and soaked into the breather. Ended up just peeling off. you can see on the image below how the resin was squeezed out from below the endplate. my brain didn't think ahead about how the pressure of the vacuum bag pushing down on the hard part would push the resin away.

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

- still had two precut pieces so I open air skinned the endplates again. Two pours of resin, but again it’s unwaxed so it’s not cured properly. It takes a little heat (sun is fine) and much more tire to cure vs waxed resin which will not tack up. Resin is now nice and thick but will need to be sanded down and polished to be level.

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

I have a bunch of CF parts on my car. I now have way more respect and now don’t mind paying the extra cost for professionally made. but like ive said before, this is a learning process. you dont expect to make carbon fibre doors your first day, just like any new hobby. i will say with every failure ive learned a lesson. so over time i hope to make a bunch more parts

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by 320icar

**edit** I’ll add photos shortly, going for dog walk

It’s all on the angle of the photo. I can give some point form of just “food for thought” of things I’ve learned. CF is carbon, FG fibre glass

- carbon fibre is expensive. 50” wide is $50/yard for your pretty standard 2x2 twill. Same size fibreglass cloth is about $10.
- CF normally used epoxy resin, it’s strong but for 1L costs about $65. FG normally uses polyester resin, which is about $18/L. Massive difference. I chose to run the cheaper poly resin since I’m just learning and I expect to make a lot of scrap material. Strength is correlated between the medium. Epoxy is like CF, poly is like FG.
- for resins there are waxed and unwaxed. It’s confusing but the easiest way to figure it out is, If you’re laminating multiple sheets or doing multiple pours, use unwaxed. If it’s a single coat. Or finishing top coat, or just a wet layup then waxed. Waxed means it air cures hard and without tack. But if you need to pour on top you must sand it down.
- a great budget setup is using the cheap vacuum storage bags from the dollar store meant for blankets etc and a shop vac. It’s just about the right amount of vacuum to conform the peel ply/bleeder cloth to the part, but not enough to pull resin out of the part. Bonus is the smell is kept in the bag and it’s not nearly as noxious.
- use more resin than you think. I was too concerned with getting the right ratio between cloth to resin for weight and strength, but that’s shooting for the stars. Mix more than you need and soak the shit out of your material. It’s better to waste $2 in resin than scrap $100 worth of cf because it didn’t saturate enough
- thinking ahead and prep-work is key. getting a quality finished product right the first time is way easier and cheaper than having to do a tonne of post work to make it passable.

My failures, there are lots.

- first flat plate I made. 8 layers CF, super strong and 2.3mm thick. Laid up on two pieces of glass with some mold release. I didn’t put enough resin down on the glass before my first layer of cf. it visually looked fully saturated but it wasn’t. Once I pulled the part, the surface finish was great but I wasn’t able to fully trace the parts I were planning on. Lesson learned, USE MORE RESIN. you can see from the photo that most the edges (easiest seen at 120'clock) did not get fully saturated. also, when trying to cut the cloth i heard of a tip online to just say use masking tape. i did, but i did not realize that YOU CANNOT PEEL THE TAPE OFF WITHOUT RUINING THE WEAVE!. so i just had to send it with the tape on. this is one of the reasons the edges didn't absorb resin. i also learned that pinching pennies by using as little cloth as possible is the wrong idea. yes its expensive, but just suck it up and use more material so you KNOW you can get your finished part out of it.

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

- second failure was another set of end plates. I couldn’t find a piece of glass or mirror the right size. Found a cheapo picture frame with a plastic front piece. Looked online and info said if you wax it, you can pull off of plastic no problem. WELL, I totally forgot I wasn’t using epoxy, I was using poly resin. Soooo the next day when I opened the vac bag, the sheet of plastic had melted with the texture of CF. Part was salvageable but surface finish was bunk. i did use the correct method for cutting straight lines though, you pull a strand out of the weave and it leaves a straight line through the entire cloth. cut and repeat! you can see the imprinted tecture on the plastic, which is pretty cool. i also need to learn to lay my weave down straighter. its sooo flexible im surprised. this was only 6 ply. still strong but i preferred the feeling of 8

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

- 3rd failure was I decided to skin the front of my second endplates. For some reason I had it in my head that I will use the vacuum setup again. So I laid a single sheet of cf on glass, soaked it, then laid my endplates on top and sealed it. WELL the pull was horrible. The resin never set properly because it’s unwaxed, and the resin that was suppose to glue to the endplate just pushed outwards and soaked into the breather. Ended up just peeling off. you can see on the image below how the resin was squeezed out from below the endplate. my brain didn't think ahead about how the pressure of the vacuum bag pushing down on the hard part would push the resin away.

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr
Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

- still had two precut pieces so I open air skinned the endplates again. Two pours of resin, but again it’s unwaxed so it’s not cured properly. It takes a little heat (sun is fine) and much more tire to cure vs waxed resin which will not tack up. Resin is now nice and thick but will need to be sanded down and polished to be level.

Untitled by 320iCar, on Flickr

I have a bunch of CF parts on my car. I now have way more respect and now don’t mind paying the extra cost for professionally made. but like ive said before, this is a learning process. you dont expect to make carbon fibre doors your first day, just like any new hobby. i will say with every failure ive learned a lesson. so over time i hope to make a bunch more parts

Waiting for you to build me a hood and trunk

But that's really cool. Kudos for getting your hands dirty on making your own parts. How much are you into it now? Are you planning to continue?

[320icar]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

But that's really cool. Kudos for getting your hands dirty on making your own parts. How much are you into it now? Are you planning to continue?

For 3x yards cf, 2x yards peel ply, breather/bleeder ply, 1L resin, Mold release, cups/sticks/brushes and consumables etc everything you need to get started, I’d say about $325 or so. Half of that cost is the the cf alone.

I will continue. I’m starting as simple as possible (flat sheets). Once I’m comfortable I’d like to remake my canards and splitter in cf, as well as other parts. The only real issue is the sheer cost of materials. You’d think a 12x12” square isn’t much, but with 8 layers that’s almost $40, then x2 If you’re making a pair. Not including all the other consumables.

I need to do research on using fibreglass sheet as some layers, or a foam core material (that won’t melt with poly). If anyone on here has fibreglass experience please hit me up

[rb]

Originally Posted by sonick

Yeah the NVH was another big reason for finding a Limited.

Noise in not sure as I haven't taken it on a prolonged highway trip, which I find the sport has pretty loud road noise. So that is TBD.

Vibration and harshness is much better in the limited. It feels more dampened when I shut the doors, and it is waaay more comfortable when going over rough streets. Comparing directly to the Sport, the limited feels like it's floating over rough roads.

I've been considering on getting rid of my 09 sport v6 because of hip/back issues. I love the motor but the ride can be quite harsh and most people don't believe me that stock setup could be this stiff lol. Would love to pick up a clean 09+ limited v6 but they're getting hard to find.

From the research I did a few years ago, the base and limited have the same susp setup. The sport model differs by having tokico blue shocks/struts with apparently stiffer springs as well.

[68style]

^ Just swap out your suspension if you know the car/like it and might be time to do that maintenance wise anyway?

[mr00jimbo]

Washed my car today. Looked gorgeous when I was done. On my drive home from where I washed it, it started raining a little bit and I got passed by a huge truck who sprayed me with mist from his mud flaps so now the car has water spots again.
Sigh.

Well cleaner than yesterday I guess lol

[dared3vil0]

Yikes. Who knows what's in the water from the splashing... You should sell the car quickly and cheaply to protect yourself

[donk.]

So i picked up my 2007 Sky 2 weeks ago.
GM forums rumor a tune that increases the hp from 260 to 290, and tq from 260 to 340. With dyno numbers.

Bought the kit, showed up 2 days ago, car re programmed.

Boost went from around 15psi to 22psi, my god, never knew a plug and play tune could turn the car into a monster.

[320icar]

Once you go modern boost you never go back

[underscore]

The optional tune from GM? My friend had it done to his old Sky, it was quite the difference. Kinda makes you wonder why they didn't just make them like that to begin with.

Same deal with my old Grand Cherokee, a couple hundred bucks and 10 mins with a dongle plugged in and it's a completely different vehicle.

[trollface]

Prob longevity of the car sake. No free lunch.

[68style]

^ Can be the reason sometimes... but I suspect like a lot of other tunes on Subaru's, Ford's, etc out there that it has more to do with meeting emissions standards than anything.

[twitchyzero]

Originally Posted by donk.

So i picked up my 2007 Sky 2 weeks ago.
GM forums rumor a tune that increases the hp from 260 to 290, and tq from 260 to 340. With dyno numbers.

Bought the kit, showed up 2 days ago, car re programmed.

Boost went from around 15psi to 22psi, my god, never knew a plug and play tune could turn the car into a monster.

now I want

[twitchyzero]

feel like I’ve being doing oil drain wrong this whole time
jacking up the car?

[underscore]

Originally Posted by trollface

Prob longevity of the car sake. No free lunch.

The tune for the Sky was from GM and kept the warranty though.

The Jeep one I know why, it's pretty obvious they didn't want it having more power than the POS 5.7L V8 that likes to blow up for no reason. The same engine is used in Europe with the same power as the tune gives you, sometimes more.

[GIZZ]

On my dirty hatch, yesterday actually. I rescaled the fuel and timing tables, replaced my 20 year old aem wideband with a new one(voltage output to ems is correct but the gauge displays leaner than it actually is). I installed a head unit and speakers. Finally was able to break isolation and leave the house, I picked up some valve stems and mounted up the last 2 tires. Now I'm fine tuning the ride height.

[trollface]

Originally Posted by underscore

The tune for the Sky was from GM and kept the warranty though.

Yeah, I mean it could last the period of the warranty. But one would think it does put a strain on the car. Broken cars, bad rep. Or they just don't want their X car making more power than their y car etc.

[donk.]

Originally Posted by twitchyzero

now I want

I was debating getting a GXP, but theres only a yellow one for sale in abbotsford. Plus im not 100% on the body lines, rice it a little and should be good to go


@underscore
I did the trifecta tune on my car, 480$CAD, obd2 to usb, download, plug, wait 20 min, done

[asian_XL]

7psi increase and only 30hp up?

[BABU]

Change out front macpherson style strut mount. Bearing all fucked, drives so much nicer now.

[68style]

LOL shit you got a kind-ass strata

[SkunkWorks]

Originally Posted by 68style

LOL shit you got a kind-ass strata

He bought that too.