Vancouver's Real Estate Market

[Gululu]

Originally Posted by J____

yes but that's unlikely to happen in the next 5 years. Investors in china are all about short term mindset, they'll do this for a year then take the money elsewhere. Nothing in China is about long term, all about making a quick buck and getting out.

Investing for long term doesn't exist in china.

[GLOW]

i think of realtors like home inspectors...unless they were in the trade or even building management/maintenance in a past life, don't expect them to really know anything about anything other than what you can learn yourself watching HGTV. they can fill in forms, add amendments or suggest things that are general rules of thumb at best. and tell you things about areas/market that you should already know yourself when house hunting.

nothing wrong with a realtor mark. doesn't change a new build's price either way afaik. at least they can review the documents and talk to you vs in house sales people that are probably even more shady than a licensed realtor

[superdennis]

I'm surprised to hear all these realtor horror stories..

I would think if anyone was to buy something significant as a home, they will research who their representative is.
If a friend refers "John doe realtor", wouldn't you ask, why John Doe? What have he done to be worthy of your referral?

I'm sure if anyone buying a car would go to a few dealerships before pulling the trigger.

There have been a surplus of 4000 new realtors since 2008...
There's many to choose from but, buyers should do their due diligence

Working with buying realtors have "buying agency contracts" as well.
Sign something with them for 3 months. If they aren't up to your expectation, terminate them.

[will068]

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

I've only worked with a few different real estate agents, but for the most part I kind of doubt they have the adequate knowledge to look at a depreciation report and interpret what type of condition things like building envelope etc are in/in need of.

They should. That's their job as a realtor. If they don't, they are inadequate. Simple as that.

It's pretty pathetic if someone cannot perform due diligence in matters in their own industry. Anyways, that is probably why you hear a number of realtor horror stories.

[Timpo]

Gregor Robertson warns Vancouver's economy at risk due to housing prices
Housing prices 'completely disconnected from local incomes,' mayor says
By Chad Pawson, CBC News Posted: Jun 05, 2016 9:51 PM PT Last Updated: Jun 05, 2016 9:51 PM PT


Gregor Robertson says he's worried Vancouver's economy will suffer if the provincial and federal governments do not legislate new taxes to stall ever-rising house prices in the city. (CBC)

Gregor Robertson warns Vancouver's economy at risk due to housing prices - British Columbia - CBC News

Gregor Robertson says recent reports and recommendations from banks, organizations, real estate boards and economists has made it clear to him that it's time to deal with Vancouver's sky-rocketing real estate prices or the city's economy could suffer.

On Sunday he released a statement amplifying his support for a house flipping tax as a measure to reduce speculation and a luxury sales tax to help, "rein in the excesses of Vancouver's housing market."

"First and foremost, housing needs to be for homes, not just treated as a commodity," said the statement.

Robertson has found convergence from multiple sources, all calling for something to be done about the state of prices for housing. This week the price tags for detached houses were shown to have increased 37 per cent since last year according to Real Estate Board of Greater Vancouver.

"These trends are not sustainable and we need to be wide awake to the risks they pose to the stability of our economy, let alone the impact they have in pushing local residents, especially young people, families, and seniors, out of our neighbourhoods," said Robertson.

In his statement he listed calls from Scotiabank and the National Bank of Canada for the federal government to intervene and an OECD report that warned Vancouver's economy is at risk due to rising household debt.

"With unregulated, speculative global capital flowing into Metro Vancouver's real estate, we are seeing housing prices completely disconnected from local incomes," said Robertson.

In February the provincial government announced measures that will require people buying homes to disclose their citizenship as there is little agreement on how much housing in Vancouver is foreign-owned.

Robertson says he will "aggressively advocate" for a flipping and luxury tax to be used as a way to "help create a level playing field in the Vancouver housing market."

Last June, the provincial government rejected calls from Robertson to levy speculation and luxury taxes on foreign owners and speculators as a way to keep prices from rising.

Premier Christy Clark said at the time that using taxes to drive down prices could hurt current homeowners by reducing their equity.

[Rallydrv]

Lol tax.. That will go in his and provinces coffers.. Ain't gonna do shit about housing prices. When people are buying 1/2/3 million $ homes.. $30-40k doesn't hurt much

Level playing field....lol

[GLOW]

he's sticking up for the little guy...


Mayor Gregor Robertson's House Sells For $1.98 Million

[Timpo]

New study: 23 years to save for an average home in Metro Vancouver
It used to take about six years to save for an average home in the region in 1976
CBC News Posted: May 25, 2016 7:46 AM PT Last Updated: May 25, 2016 12:50 PM PT

New study: 23 years to save for an average home in Metro Vancouver - British Columbia - CBC News


It used to take five years for a typical young person to save a 20 per cent down payment on an average home in Canada. Now, it takes 23 years in Metro Vancouver. (Generation Squeezed)

A young person today will have to work for 23 years to save for a down payment on an average Metro Vancouver home.

That's according to a new study entitled Code Red: Rethinking Canadian Housing Policy (pdf), authored by Paul Kershaw of the UBC School of Population and Public Health and Anita Minh, a researcher at Kershaw's Generation Squeeze Research and Knowledge Translation Lab.

In 1976 it took nearly six years of full time work for the average 25- to 34-year-old to save a 20 per cent down payment for an average-priced Metro Vancouver home, according to the study.

These days, with house prices soaring, the average young person needs to work for 16 years to save a down payment for an average home in B.C., and 23 years to save for an average home in Metro Vancouver.

Along with the rising cost of housing, the authors blame a $9,000 drop in average real wages in B.C. (after inflation), rising rents, longer and more expensive commutes and expensive child care for the widening gap.

Meanwhile, those who were fortunate enough to buy a home in the 1970's are benefiting from the price increases, the study found.

"This means the typical older resident of B.C. – not the one per cent – has now accumulated additional wealth from their housing that is equivalent to having purchased two homes when they were young adults," says the study.

The authors conclude that the primary driver of net wealth for Canadians over the age of 50 — soaring house prices —is now the primary source of debt for their children.

It's not how hard you work

The authors note generational trends in wealth and debt accumulation from the housing market largely reflect the lottery of timing.

"The wealth gains reported by Canadians 55+ do not primarily represent smart decisions, hard work or other factors that would suggest this wealth has been 'earned."

"There is no clear evidence that these generations purchased and consumed housing resources more cleverly and productively than did their parents' generations," they write.

"Similarly, the higher mortgage debts reported by the average young person today do not reflect a lesser work ethic, or poorer judgment with respect to the housing market. Higher mortgages reflect the reality of getting into the housing market when the timing is not nearly as fortuitous as it was in 1977."

And they say it's unfair to argue that young people should not have the same expectations for home ownership as older generations did.

"While some may argue that the dramatic increase in housing costs should give young people pause before committing to home ownership, home ownership has been a strong Canadian norm for many decades now."

"It is understandable that many younger people believe this goal is worthy of pursuit – at least to the same degree it was prioritised by their parents' generation."

To solve the problem the study makes 10 recommendations to reform the housing market and make it more affordable for younger workers while protecting property values for existing home owners.

"It is imperative for political parties to turn their attention in advance of the 2017 election to the broad range of costs squeezing young adults. We can help ease the housing squeeze by no longer tolerating child care, parental leave, transportation, etc. adding up to second, third and fourth mortgage payments," concludes Kershaw.

[threezero]

Originally Posted by GLOW

he's sticking up for the little guy...


Mayor Gregor Robertson's House Sells For $1.98 Million

considering some of the place selling for more than that in richmond, the mayor's place actually seem like a good deal lol

[imp>dom]

Originally Posted by will068

@imp>dom You mean your agent did not do their own analysis and present them to you ? (E.g. if the townhome is a good value based on the attributes of the property).

You have lazy ass agent. Drop that agent. That agent probably just sends you daily listings that fall under some simple filter criteria.

No it's just the seller's agent. I made a phone call out of curiosity.

[UFO]

Originally Posted by 4444

the only local buying power is from those that have sold, but this is not real wealth when sales proceeds are used on another home (unless you downsize and take the differential as cash/cash equivalent)

There are a fair number of average middle wage earning locals in our parents' demographic who own multiple homes/condos as investment properties, bought in the 70's, 80's, 90's, and even early 00's. They did not buy thinking values would shoot up to where they are today, but on the fundamental that home values always appreciate over the long run. They were fortunate to ride the recent sharp upwards curve, and many have taken that fortuitous turn and cashed out, lots of 'free' money floating around from these cases. These are not 'smart' investors, just lucky ones. But they do play a large role to sway the market

people have asked what will cause a crash, something small will do it, it's just a case of when it will happen:

If one of the following happens:
China slightly cracks down
The Canadian/BC government actually does something to represent and support its locals (in the long term view) - this looks like the least likely event
A group gets spooked for some unknown reason and that pocket of selling gathers traction
Rates rise to the point where affordability

As soon as market prices go down, people get into the issue of not being able to renew mortgages as banks cannot lend above a certain LTV - I'm not an expert on the rules anymore, but this is what will cause a spiraling issue.

That's as much speculation and conjecture as someone who says that any slack from a downward price adjustment will be taken up by those on the sidelines or investors looking for a deal. There are too many variables to account for, variables that you simply don't understand or can't account for (or anybody else for that matter).

Yes, we can say 'there are plenty of buyers on the sideline" - but smart investors don't catch a falling knife, they wait until the bottom / after the bleeding has stopped.

I would suggest most buying into homes now for investments aren't smart investors, but average people with money on hand looking for a safe place to put their money. So while there may be many buyers who arent smart investors, these are the ones who I feel would keep things reasonably afloat should anything drastic happen.

Just food for thought rather than blindly saying "locals have so much buying power" or "the chinese will buy up everything if prices crash" - this is what the real estate board and crusty want you to believe, but if you have to live in vancouver, do you honestly think this is sustainable and will continue? no where else in the world has a bubble like this ever sustained

Definitely not sustainable, but how long have the doomsday crowd been preaching about the bubble popping yet the prices keep climbing at an ever steeper rate. The reality is some sort of correction is bound to happen at some point in time, but it will not be of a sky is falling magnitude and it will still leave things in an unaffordable state by traditional measures, IMO

[A-Dev]

Originally Posted by GLOW

he's sticking up for the little guy...


Mayor Gregor Robertson's House Sells For $1.98 Million

He sold but is now priced out of the place he wanted to buy next. "Housing market at risk!..."

[EmperorIS]

He probably sold the house to bribe his girlfriend's mom out of jail in China.

[J____]

Originally Posted by smoothie.

i dont even.

what, you know china so well?

[J____]

Originally Posted by Gululu

Investing for long term doesn't exist in china.

exactly

[unit]

Originally Posted by GLOW

he's sticking up for the little guy...


Mayor Gregor Robertson's House Sells For $1.98 Million

you say that like that's a lot for a detached home in the west end. its average at best and really not newsworthy.

[MarkyMark]

My girlfriends mom sold her townhouse in coquitlam yesterday. It was built in 83', and fairly big at 1850sq/f. 1.5 baths.

Other than the new carpets upstairs and in the basement, pretty much every appliance needs to be replaced, the bathroom needs to be redone, kitchen badly needs updating and the main floor needs new laminate. No garage one reserved parking spot. Oh and a certain spot in the matter bedroom leaks during heavy rain.

The open house was this weekend over a hundred groups of people showed up, they listed it at 435 and sold it for 490 no subjects, not even an inspection.

Not only that but pretty much every major bidder wrote a letter kissing ass hoping that they'd accept their offer.

What a shitty time to be buying real estate lol

To put things in perspective a unit last summer in that complex sold for 400

[GLOW]

Originally Posted by A-Dev

He sold but is now priced out of the place he wanted to buy next. "Housing market at risk!..."

he bought a newer smaller home in a nicer area for roughly 25% less so made out pretty good.

good time to fight the housing crisis

[hud 91gt]

Originally Posted by GLOW

he's sticking up for the little guy...


Mayor Gregor Robertson's House Sells For $1.98 Million

I'd like to know who ended up with the house. That seems far too cheap. I know of a duplex that sold twelve streets south of that (away from the water) that sold for his asking price. What gives.

[dat_steve]

1.98 on paper, another 1.98 in some sort of sheltered account overseas i bet.

[westopher]

That also was over a year ago. Sold for 2 million, would sell today for 3.5? Pretty much the way the market has gone for detached westside homes.
If anything he probably wants to cool the market because he's butthurt he lost 1.5 mil by selling his house too early.

[Ferra]

Originally Posted by J____

took out a 3 million mortgage at 2-3% to purchase a 5 million dollar Vancouver house, then took the 3 million and put it in a Chinese bank's term deposit to get back 5% interest. Free money, great for banks and the person with enough funds to do this but it really fucks over the working class in Vancouver...

Doesn't work (aka. forward exchange rate, no arbitrage)

People doing this are stupid and doing it at significant risk.
(e.g. Many corporations and governments in developing countries took out massive loans in USD during the past few years, they saved a ton of interest with the low USD interest rate (3% vs 8%), but now they are getting screwed having to pay back in USD with the USD up 30-50% against their local currency...there is no free lunch)


I think CRA should just start taxing the influx of money immigrants are bringing in, regardless of source or the person's residency...it is not very fair, but... they can afford it.

[Hondaracer]

The thing is, they can all afford whatever "tax" you want to introduce as well.

[MarkyMark]

Well then if they wipe their ass with any tax we could give them then sounds like a good place to start. If they don't care then make it some absurd amount. Milk the cow baby.

Maybe every foreign buyer should have to donate an undisclosed amount to TransLink to qualify. Let's see how bad they want a house.

[westopher]

It will curb flippers though.
Realistically I don't understand how anyone without residency should be allowed to purchase a home anyways. If you can't actually live in the country, theres no reason a government shouldn't be able to tell you to fuck off when it comes to people actually being unable to LIVE in the city you are parking your investment in.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Shelter is a basic human necessity, and it should be prevented from being treated as a commodity at least at basic levels.
Yeah my communism is showing again, but the amount of money sitting stagnant in rich peoples bank accounts and parked in empty homes is doing no fucking good for society.