Vancouver's Real Estate Market

[westopher]

Any building improvement could be covered by contingency fund, or couldn’t depending on what’s there. Higher fees could mean better fund, and less chance of large special assessments, or if it’s managed badly, couldn’t help. Really the costs don’t paint the picture unless you know the building and what’s included. A place with $300 + a gas + radiant heating costs could cost you more than the place with $400 condo fees.

[immorality]

Originally Posted by JDMDreams

From my experience strata likes to increase at about 10% a year, so yes it's still very high as it only goes up from here. That 10% doesn't cover any special levies either.

From my (admittedly very limited) experience, that, at least recently, has been due to the giant spike in insurance costs.

[68style]

Every new building starts at $350+ now for strata... it's not as bad as Ontario (yet) but it's quickly getting there.

Mine was $250 all of last year and now suddenly it's $348 and it's because, as mentioned by the wise man above, insurance... $280,000 of last year's budget in a 200 unit complex was fucking insurance costs.

[westopher]

Edmontons are fucking crazy too. There's 1000sqft 2 beds with >$800 even into the thousands. Last I checked we are at around $330 for a 700sqft 1 bed/den, and it really doesn't include much. 2015 build.
The craziest shit though, that condo will cost you 300k + that $800 or more, or you can just buy a house for $350k. Why would anyone live in a condo?

[68style]

Originally Posted by westopher

The craziest shit though, that condo will cost you 300k + that $800 or more, or you can just buy a house for $350k. Why would anyone live in a condo?

This is what I do not understand. There's many places in the world this is true too.

I thought there's no way Toronto's real estate market for condos could be crazy because the strata fees are massive, but it proved me super wrong. Likewise, if you look at most places in Honolulu for example, lots and lots of units there near Ala Moana Center for example have like $1500-2000 monthly strata! How is that even tenable?! Why would anyone not buy a house?

I've seen Chicago is just as bad on those "here's 3 options pick one" shows on HGTV too... just cannot understand why anyone would sign up for a lifetime of exorbitant monthly payments.

[saiko]

River District for me, 4 year old building. Strata fees were $0.41/sq ft (880 sqft), we were paying $360.

Building insurance was a huge factor for increase, we're now paying $480/mo... Being on Strata Council we've already adjusted all the contracts to more budget friendly companies and reduce the frequency of some services.. and it has still gone up year after year!

[westopher]

Especially, it doesn’t take a mathematician to realize, mortgage payments go to building equity, strata fees basically disappear into thin air. You could have 25 years of $2500 payments to end up with a million in equity or $400k, and have had to live in a smaller, less private place with shared walls for your 600k hit.

[68style]

I was able to justify mine by it covering gas and we also have a full gym and pool so the fitness side of things is worth a lot to me too… but if it goes above $400 I will have to rethink things.

[westopher]

I mean, here the gaps are so different though. If I add my mortgage and strata I still would need to add another 2k a month to step up to detached.

[winson604]

1400 sq feet started out at $330 or so when it was built 4 years ago. Raised to $380 after the first year and has stayed the same every year since. Next AGM in the summer so maybe due for a raise.

[Euro7r]

Originally Posted by saiko

River District for me, 4 year old building. Strata fees were $0.41/sq ft (880 sqft), we were paying $360.

Building insurance was a huge factor for increase, we're now paying $480/mo... Being on Strata Council we've already adjusted all the contracts to more budget friendly companies and reduce the frequency of some services.. and it has still gone up year after year!

I'm in a new building at RD, took possession last November. $340/mth strata fees for 600sq ft unit. I take long hot showers since I figured I'm paying for it part of my strata fees, gotta milk it lol.

[bcedhk]

Originally Posted by Euro7r

I'm in a new building at RD, took possession last November. $340/mth strata fees for 600sq ft unit. I take long hot showers since I figured I'm paying for it part of my strata fees, gotta milk it lol.

Isn't insurance along RD going off the charts because of the whole floodplain scare?

[saiko]

Originally Posted by Euro7r

I'm in a new building at RD, took possession last November. $340/mth strata fees for 600sq ft unit. I take long hot showers since I figured I'm paying for it part of my strata fees, gotta milk it lol.

No kidding, my wife and I also. Gas (hot water), heat (radiant floor/hot water), and stove. Somewhat lessens the pain when I know my place is quite toasty for the winter.

[PeanutButter]

$0.40 a sq/ft or below is ideal

If you're in a strata, you should be looking at your annual financials and try to figure out where the money is going. There's a lot of inefficiencies in a lot of strata's and figuring these out are easy ways to save money and build a bigger contingency fund.

[Euro7r]

Originally Posted by bcedhk

Isn't insurance along RD going off the charts because of the whole floodplain scare?

Don't believe so, as far as my knowledge understands. Even with the whole flooding situation we had last year, there was no flooding issues at RD. Heard some areas were fucked last year in Richmond, so strangely RD didn't have impact that I knew about.

[hotjoint]

My townhouse is 1527 sq/ft. Moved in last year and strata was $252. They've increased it this year to $280 because of water/sewage not being accounted for in the initial costs. Not bad for a 189 unit complex. Pretty low compared to other places

[6thGear.]

$383/month for a 775sf unit. $0.49/sf at Avalon 1/RD

Originally Posted by bcedhk

Isn't insurance along RD going off the charts because of the whole floodplain scare?

Not for our building

[Spectre_Cdn]

$357/month, 550sqft in RD. 2020 build

Yeah, it’s hella pricey at $0.65/sqft

[Eff-1]

Random thoughts in no particular order about strata fees:

- Insurance premiums skyrocked in 2019 and have been going up ever since, however this year the increases are not as steep, from what I have seen and heard

- This year, it's inflation that is hitting strata budgets hard. A massive amount of budget goes towards paying for trades and contractors: cleaners, building caretakers, garbage removal, fire inspectors, window washers, electricians, HVAC maintenance, landscapers, EVERYONE is jacking up their rates on account on inflation, fuel surcharges, etc etc. Expect 10 - 15% increases across the board. Don't get me started on elevator maintenance companies, they are like the mafia and are VERY expensive and can basically charge whatever they want and you have no negotiation power.

- Snow removal costs took a big jump the past year due to new insurance requirements they were required to get.

- Speaking of snow removal, the local climate has a massive impact on monthly costs. We are lucky here because our climate is mild. But Edmonton, Toronto, even Whistler, they pay a lot just for a/c in the summer and snow removal/heating in the winter. Way more than us, generally.

- For example: Another trade that jumped in cost a lot this past year was pest removal, specifically rat and mouse traps. The gov't made of the pesticides illegal, and so they now require more frequent maintenance because the less toxic stuff isn't as effective. More frequent maintenance means more costs.

- A lot of the newer buildings are coming with very fancy amenities. I've seen touchless automated car washes, bowling lanes, glass bottom pools, etc etc. Even a fancy water feature out front. Sounds great if you're in the market to buy. All of that costs a lot of money to maintain and upkeep. It also means more expensive insurance premiums because of the high reconstruction costs. We have very fancy treadmills the developer installed with digital screens. One of those screens died this year and it was VERY expensive to replace. Stuff like that needs to be budgeted for.

- Developers will often set the initial first year budget quite low. Yes, part of it is because they do it intentionally to draw in buyers. But also it's not really possible to know how much a building costs to run until a year or two later, as there are often a lot of big costs you simply won't know until they surface.

- The biggest thing, however, that impacts your budget is how smart and/or diligent your strata council is. Strata councils are volunteers and there's no minimum requirements to be part of it. You could have a council of 7 idiots with zero financial experience. And believe me when I say a lot of property managers (who are supposed to guide the council) are idiots too. It's the blind leading the blind. Our annual operating budget is seven figures and so far we have been very lucky to have 2 CPAs on our council who are smart and pay very close attention to our budget and bookkeeping. I'm so appreciative to have them. If you're unlucky to have morons on your council, hang on tight because those people can make careless decisions that could have serious financial implications for all owners, either now or in the future. This is the only reason why I joined our council, so that I'd at least know what was going on and not let others make decisions that impact me personally. TBH I hate being on council because it's a lot of time and stress but the idea of someone else running it scares me more.

[van_driver]

$555/month for a 775 sq ft unit in downtown, built in 2007

[GIZZ]

As much as I want to say throwing money at strata is a waste, a house probably always costs more. I did my roof last year, repipe the year before, furnace is coming up next. Everytime I turn around it's another 15G. My damn house insurance and property taxes are over 10G a year. But the single worst part about this place that will make me move to a condo is the amount of time I spend maintaining it.

[Hondaracer]

You’re adding value to the home with those though

Also some stuff like landscaping etc. you’re not really forced to do or spend any money on it if you don’t want

[TOS'd]

$0.78/sqft

[Alpine]

The townhome units at the base of a condo tower get hit the worst. They can be the size of a standard townhome (ie. 1100-1400sqft), but pay the standard condo strata rates. While a regular townhouse of that size might be $300/mo in strata, these units pay $700-1200/mo...

[donk.]

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

You’re adding value to the home with those though

Also some stuff like landscaping etc. you’re not really forced to do or spend any money on it if you don’t want

50% of strata fees also add value to the home
When the entire building gets a new roof or siding, you already paid for it on a monthly basis

Cue poorly managed stratas that defer maintenance, and owners are slapped with 5-15k bills