REVscene - Vancouver Automotive Forum

JesseBlue · 09-09-2013, 05:12 PM

i thought this was a perfect case for forfeiture..

Rainei · 09-09-2013, 05:31 PM

If you're thinking of those big yellow school buses.. I don't think a 300kg mass would do much damage..... Unless it gets ramped up 1.5 m off the surface of the road.

I wonder how many kids he could kill going 300km/h into the side of a bus.

Phil@rise · 09-09-2013, 05:40 PM

"Bowden said the defendant’s “uncontradicted” evidence for the July 2, 2011, event was that the road was long and straight, the weather was sunny and clear with good visibility, its surface was dry and there were no other vehicles on the road or in sight.

He said there were no pedestrians on the road or in sight, and the Ducati was in perfect working condition and its brakes and tires had recently been replaced."

Did you guys read that? Some of you it seems would love to live in a police state with a totalitarian leader or regime governing over us.
He didnt endanger anyone but himself. Let evolution weed out the stupid or week theres no need to give up liberties or freedoms and put in place laws that limit all of us. Unless of course your happy sheep?
I for one would like to know I can stray away from the comfort of my herd and not be banished or be stripped of my piece of the pasture for doing so.
We live in a free country people if you dont like that so be it, move south.

falcon · 09-09-2013, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Traum

I agree with the courts denying the government of the forfeiture. At the same time, what do you suppose could be done to prevent this guy from behind a hazard to the community?

Income based speeding tickets, that are enforced by Revenue Canada so you can't get away from them.

Phil@rise · 09-09-2013, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by falcon

Income based speeding tickets, that are enforced by Revenue Canada so you can't get away from them.

Ohhh thats a great idea lets give the government more reach into our pockets lol

vitaminG · 09-09-2013, 05:53 PM

i think the main thing is that he wasnt charged with dangerous driving which is a criminal code conviction, he was charged with speeding which is the BC motor vehicle act.

if he was criminally charged they might have had a case, its a slippery slope if they try to use civil forfeiture in motor vehicle act violations.

but he just got saddled with thousands of dollars in lawyer fees. so he'll probably have to sell his bike anyways

Soundy · 09-09-2013, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainei

If you're thinking of those big yellow school buses.. I don't think a 300kg mass would do much damage..... Unless it gets ramped up 1.5 m off the surface of the road.

You wouldn't think a little 3oz. piece of lead could rip a massive hole in something soft, either, but it does. F=ma. Look it up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil@rise

He said there were no pedestrians on the road or in sight, and the Ducati was in perfect working condition and its brakes and tires had recently been replaced."

...

He didnt endanger anyone but himself.

Should I post those bike-hits-deer videos again? Remember the ones where the deer appears out of nowhere and the rider has no time to react at HALF the speed this clown was going?

At those speeds, he's endangering ANYONE else using the road in his vicinity. At 200km/h, he's covering 56m/s... over 180ft PER SECOND. Car pulls onto the road off the shoulder, or from a side road... that car is toast as well. F=ma. Even if he does see it, he doesn't have time to react, let alone stop in time, unless he sacrifices himself by swerving into the ditch.

Whether you 'get' the physics of it or not, the fact remains, he wasn't thinking of anything else except himself, something that's borne by the sheer number of his previous convictions.

Quote:

Let evolution weed out the stupid or week theres no need to give up liberties or freedoms and put in place laws that limit all of us. Unless of course your happy sheep?

Now you're starting to sound like CiC. Wanting to be able to use the roads safely without having to worry about some brainless asshole on a bike does not make one a "sheep".

Quote:

I for one would like to know I can stray away from the comfort of my herd and not be banished or be stripped of my piece of the pasture for doing so.

You can "stray away from the comfort of the herd" on a track, where the herd is kept clear. On the streets, the herd would like to be able to go about their own lives without having to look over their shoulders.

Mancini · 09-09-2013, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainei

$3600??? That is a ridiculously low number if you think about it. One excessive speeding ticket nowadays costs $483? The DRP is $320 for 3 years, so thats $960. One single excessive speeding ticket would cost him $1443. So how is the remaining $2200 split among the 38 other driving offenese and 5 suspensions?

You forgot towing, impound costs, and travel costs to get home (these can be especially high if your car is impounded far from home).

Marco911 · 09-09-2013, 08:38 PM

This is exactly how a justice system of checks and balances should work in the first place. It is insane that as a society we allow our politicians to write laws that strip an individual of their property rights for traffic offences which do not even rise to the level of a criminal offence. There are too many morons in society, like Soundy, who have no concept about the fundamental importance of private property rights. i've come out strongly against these civil forfeiture laws in the past, and I am pleased that the courts have sided with my opinion on this issue.

Gridlock · 09-09-2013, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soundy

You wouldn't think a little 3oz. piece of lead could rip a massive hole in something soft, either, but it does. F=ma. Look it up.

Should I post those bike-hits-deer videos again? Remember the ones where the deer appears out of nowhere and the rider has no time to react at HALF the speed this clown was going?

At those speeds, he's endangering ANYONE else using the road in his vicinity. At 200km/h, he's covering 56m/s... over 180ft PER SECOND. Car pulls onto the road off the shoulder, or from a side road... that car is toast as well. F=ma. Even if he does see it, he doesn't have time to react, let alone stop in time, unless he sacrifices himself by swerving into the ditch.

Whether you 'get' the physics of it or not, the fact remains, he wasn't thinking of anything else except himself, something that's borne by the sheer number of his previous convictions.

Now you're starting to sound like CiC. Wanting to be able to use the roads safely without having to worry about some brainless asshole on a bike does not make one a "sheep".

You can "stray away from the comfort of the herd" on a track, where the herd is kept clear. On the streets, the herd would like to be able to go about their own lives without having to look over their shoulders.

Yes, you are arguing "won't someone think of the kittens" and phil is arguing "live free or die"

I don't think anyone thinks that this is a case of letting the guy go about his business free and clear because he decided that it was a safe road to let loose on.

What everyone IS saying is that he didn't hit 200kph in a shopping mall with school kids present. And we're all saying that for fuck sakes, we're not supposed to fear the government.

I don't like them having too much power.

It's why I dislike the road side drunk driving laws. People would turn that around and say, "so you support drunk driving?" and its a matter of no, but I support our system of laws.

Create a system where he can be charged with reckless endangerment and excess speeding. Great. Put financial penalties toward that. We can argue it, change it, waive it or whatever, but the same rules apply for everyone.

But to sit there and decide to go after his property...one of the base rights of our justice system, that of ownership, becomes punitive.

And that's where I redflag this shit.

These cases should be rare, and directly related to people profiting from crime.

If he bought the bike by selling kilos of coke to high school kids, then we'll talk about civil forfeiture, and hash that out in court, proving without a doubt that the money was illicit in nature.

Phil@rise · 09-09-2013, 10:20 PM

Wow! I've been likened to CiC.
Soundy thems fightin words lol!! But really you and many others like you seem all to cavalier with your freedoms all for the sake of "safety". In reality there is nothin more dangerous to us, then a government with too much power or authority. It doesnt take long till your left with nothing and for what? Some safety from a dude riding his MC down a desolate road with no one around to hear his screams as he crashes into an innocent dear except the cop hiding behind the bill board trying to rack up some cash giving out tickets.
More laws dont make the world a safer place. Thats a delusion. Smoke and mirrors, lies told to you by those that want control and power over you.
Thats not CiC thats real.

meme405 · 09-09-2013, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soundy

Tell ya what, go learn something about Grade 9 physics before speaking again. Here's a formula for you to start with: F=ma

the bike and him weigh a collective 400lbs at most.

even at 200 directly into the side of the bus, I guarantee the only fatality is himself. Sure the kids would get a shock, but he would plough almost entirely into the frame of the school bus. the actual seats and risk zone to the children is far to high up on the school bus for a motorcycle to harm anyone seriously.

EDIT:

Everytime this shit comes around, there is Soundy, on the side of "he was speeding, burn him at the cross", I really want to put a GPS on your car and see how often you are speeding.

Its easy to sit in your house and rant and rave on the internet about how speeding is dangerous, and anything could happen, but I bet once you hop in your car you are going 10 or 20 kmph (if not more) in many places.

The truth is, YES, ANYTHING could happen, fuck a ferret could pop out of the bushes and send him hurtling into a house, BUT IT DIDN'T, and now for the goverment to come along and seize his property for a law that has nothing to do with simple motor vehicle violations is an absolute breach of our civil liberties. im glad this got crushed, because it could have set a very dangerous precedent.

Great68 · 09-09-2013, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil@rise

"Bowden said the defendant’s “uncontradicted” evidence for the July 2, 2011, event was that the road was long and straight, the weather was sunny and clear with good visibility, its surface was dry and there were no other vehicles on the road or in sight.

He said there were no pedestrians on the road or in sight, and the Ducati was in perfect working condition and its brakes and tires had recently been replaced."

Willis Point Road:

Better watch those kids jumping out of the woods.

1BADMR2 · 09-10-2013, 06:53 AM

I am sooo happy that the courts decide the punishment and not the government.
Canada is a free country not a policed state (yet).

Gridlock · 09-10-2013, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1BADMR2

I am sooo happy that the courts decide the punishment and not the government.
Canada is a free country not a policed state (yet).

He still had to pay to defend himself against these bastards.

This is OUR government doing this. Now might be a time to let your elected representative know that this is bullshit.