REVscene Automotive Forum - Anti-vaccine people

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To parents that CHOOSE not to immunize their kids - don't be offended if I ask you if you immunized your kids or not, or if you say they're not, that they are asked to not join certain large group activities, or group activities at all.

It's a crime for HIV+ people to engage in sex without notifying partners about their disease. It should be the same for unvaccinated people participating in group activities. If you have a problem with being treated differently or being excluded then get used to it. I have a right to know if I'm putting myself at risk just by being in your presence.

If this is a trend that continues, then we need regulations in place for contact with these folks. Regular checkups, certifications and assurances that the unvaccinated people are currently uninfected. I'm fine with that. If you're not going to be vaccinated then that's your choice, but be responsible about it, especially when it comes to the well-being of others.

To observer;
There are different figures floating around, I initially saw one saying 1-10,000 Amish get autism but its probably false.

Looks like you're good at researching, can you tell me why infants need the hepatitis B vaccine?

edit

Quote:

Originally Posted by observer (Post 8437748)

So if you're looking for an excuse not to protect your child (and the children he or she comes into contact with) from smallpox, polio, mumps, etc., pointing to the Amish does not help your argument at all.

Also when I said the Amish are still around, this is to the question that was raised about if we totally stop all vaccinations.

edit 2
I also read a report about some Amish secretly vaccinating... so the numbers will never be a perfect statistic... but of course much better then 1 in 50 rate of the U.S. (Frobes Magazine)

Ive flooded this thread with lots of links, but here are two more I found in my archives.

How Vaccines Harm Child Brain Development - Dr Russell Blaylock MD
_youtube.com/watch?v=7QBcMYqlaDs

38 Children Recovered in 20 months with MMS (video speech)
38 Children Recovered in 20 months with MMS - UNIVERSALLY AWARE

Not everything is a conspiracy. Jesus.

Quote:

Originally Posted by russc (Post 8437798)

Not everything is a conspiracy. Jesus.

According to most Infowars readers, everything is a false flag / conspiracy / controlled by the NWO / Jewish banker cabal / lizard aliens / etc etc etc

i have never really taken a vaccine shot & the reason for that is cuz

1. i dont like shots, very scared of them

2. most importantly my dad believes it might cause me side effects

if u wash your hands all time & stuff like that u should be fine, im living in china right now & i go to the wet market everyday dont have a problem

i have only been vaccinated twice (under my knowledge):

1st time was in elementary i was very young & i cry like a little bitch & everyone started laughing at me

2nd time was in HS, the fat old lady told me to look away from the needle but i told her i like to watch the needle go through & i also want u to punch/stable it in, everyone thought i was a freak (i remember this was bought up during PT meet afterwards)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ae101 (Post 8437836)

i have never really taken a vaccine shot & the reason for that is cuz

1. i dont like shots, very scared of them

Seriously... it's a split second of pain... I would rather a pin prick in my arm than a couple weeks of a horrible disease that could kill me!

Dare I say... man up?!

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8437657)

A Freemasonic lords of the underground

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8437758)

Looks like you're good at researching, can you tell me why infants need the hepatitis B vaccine?

Thanks for the compliments. I was just curious about your statement earlier, did a quick search and find the results apparently contradictory to the claims.

Most conspiracies can be shot down with a few google searches.

Results why infants need hepatitis B vaccine.

The apparently more credible links from the list above:

CDC - Hepatitis B Fact Sheet for Parents - Vaccines

Why Infants Should Receive the Hepatitis B Vaccine at Birth | Shot of Prevention

Nothing is 100% certain, but all we need to do is to assess the likelihood.

Occam's razor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here is a good talk: How to separate fact and fiction online.

I'd like to get your take on why a little baby should be exposed to possible mercury(neurotoxin), aluminum(neurotoxin) and mycoplasma viruses over and over again, 3 times for 6 month old Canadian infant, for this vaccine? You do know how its passed on to others I presume.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8437892)

It makes sense to me that in small doses the body can learn how to fight this shit and build up it's immune system.

I attribute my ox-like health to the fact that I grew up playing outdoors and in dirt since I was a toddler.

One of my friends grew up in an apartment completely sheltered as a child, in her adult life she is sick with a cold or the flu more often than she is not. She also has a ton of allergies.

Why would a baby need this vaccine at such a young age?

Quote:

Q: How do you get hepatitis B? How can I protect myself?

A: Hepatitis B is caused by the hepatitis B virus (HBV). The virus interferes with the functions of the liver and activates the immune system, which produces a specific reaction to combat the virus. As a consequence of pathological damage, the liver becomes inflamed. A small percentage of infected people cannot get rid of the virus and become chronically infected – these people are at high risk of death from cirrhosis of the liver and liver cancer.

Hepatitis B virus is transmitted by contact with blood or body fluids of an infected person – the same way as the human immunodeficiency virus (HIV). However, HBV is 50 to 100 times more infectious than HIV.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8437892)

Read the above links or do your own research?

The TED Talk link I posted earlier is quite interesting, while it doesn't specifically address what we are discussing, it does provide a few tricks on how to tell fiction from fact.

The bottom line is that there is a lot of BS out there.

an infected person isn't limited to IV drug use and promiscuity

one can catch hepatitis B without having sex

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8437911)

Why would a baby need this vaccine at such a young age?

Ok, have done the summary for you:

According to information provided by the Immunization Action Coalition and the CDC, an estimated 1.25 million people are chronically infected with the hepatitis B virus in the United States alone, resulting in an estimated 2,000-4,000 deaths each year. Surprisingly, 30%-40% of these chronic infections were acquired during childhood. This fact alone presents a compelling case for vaccinating infants – before they become infected.

Parents need to understand that the hepatitis B virus can be spread by infectious blood and body fluids, and not solely through sexual contact. As a parent myself, I can recall countless times that I have tended to children, both my own and others, who have suffered scrapes, cuts, nose bleeds and even bites from frustrated playmates. These are realistic opportunities for exposure since the CDC has stated that the virus remains viable and infectious in the environment for at least 7 days and can remain present in inanimate objects absent of visible blood. Since only 7 out of 10 infected adults show any signs or symptoms, and infected children under age 5 rarely show any symptoms at all, it is obvious how the infected population can easily, and unknowingly, be transmitting the disease to others.

One of the issues that Deborah Wexler, from the Immunization Action Coalition, addresses is that many of those who become infected with the hepatitis B virus contract the disease from their unknowingly infected mother at birth. Dr. Wexler explains, “There are so many parents and healthcare professionals who think this vaccine is wrongly given at birth for an STD that might be acquired later in life. But the most important reason for it is to prevent HBV infection early in life with the possible life-long complications of chronic disease in the form of liver failure and liver cancer that affect so many who are infected at birth. I wish this message were more broadly disseminated, but it is a difficult message to discuss due to its complexity, the need to explain how medical errors might occur and why testing isn’t infallible, or how exposures could occur in an infant.”

While OBGYNs suggest the mother be tested prior to delivery, there are many instances when this does not occur, or when it is possible that the mother contracts the disease in the period after testing, but before birth. Properly identifying infected mothers is complicated since there can be errors in test ordering, result interpretation or even test inaccuracy. Therefore, administering the first dose of the hepatitis B vaccine soon after birth minimizes the risk for infection from the mother or from other infected persons who may be living in the household. Additionally, the hepatitis B vaccine can actually help prevent infection in infants who are born from mothers with the virus in their blood. This serves as another important fact to support vaccinating your child according to the recommended schedule.

Studies also indicate that the long-term chronic health issues related to this virus, such as liver failure, cirrhosis, and liver cancer, are directly related to when a person is first infected. For example, 90% of infants who are infected will ultimately develop chronic symptoms later in life, however, when the illness is contracted at an older age, the chronic effects are less prominent. Only 30% of children age 1-5 who contract hepatitis B will go on to develop these chronic issues. Once again, these figures demonstrate the benefit of starting infants on the multi-dose vaccination series as soon as possible after birth in order to provide the greatest preventative effect on the population.

each vaccine comes with a small booklet detailing the possible side affects from it. things like temporal and permanent paralyzation, diarrhoea, loss of sight and getting sick from the actual disease itself, its all possible effects. of course not one gets to see that booklet as the packaging is usually discard by the physician administering the shot. The chance of getting these side affects is very very slim but it can happen.

It would be naive to think vaccine is 100% safe, its not. however it chance of failure is very low.

Chances of failure low, interesting did you read the disclosed documents released through freedom of information act to come to those conclusions?

Quote:

Originally Posted by observer (Post 8437916)

Read the above links or do your own research?

.....

The bottom line is that there is a lot of BS out there.

I suppose you watched that TED Talk, fact or fiction, talk yourself, how do you know what you're relaying here is in fact, fact?

And lastly how does a baby contract Hepatitis in your own words?

Do anti-vaxxers need a ?nudge?? More like a kick in the pants - The Globe and Mail

Quote:

A measles outbreak in B.C.’s Fraser Valley has spread into the general population, beyond the Chilliwack Christian school where it is thought to have started. There’s one important component missing from that sentence: I should have said, “an entirely preventable measles outbreak.” Like recent outbreaks in Alberta and Quebec, there is no reason why this should have happened, except that people are refusing to have their children vaccinated – and thus putting other people at risk.
More Related to this Story. Fraser Valley Measles outbreak prompts officials to issue national plea for vaccination B.C. gears up for measles after two new Chilliwack cases As a doctor, I've seen why vaccination is a 'no brainer'

Vaccination rates have fallen in many industrialized countries over the past 15 years for no good reason, and many bad ones. You need only look at the Council on Foreign Relations map showing thousands of recent cases of entirely preventable diseases – measles, mumps, whooping cough – in places where vaccines are free, safe and readily available. Parents in Syria will brave bombs and gunfire to have their kids vaccinated – what excuses do parents in Western Europe and North America have?

In hyper-health conscious New York, there’s been another recent outbreak of measles, which caused Russell Saunders, a doctor writing under a pen name in The Daily Beast, to write an understandably angry piece: “Just over a dozen years ago this illness was considered eliminated in our country, and this year people are being hospitalized for it. All due to the hysteria about a safe, effective vaccine. All based on nothing.” He points out that measles is not an easily dismissed virus: It can lead to severe complications, and in three cases out of 1,000, death.

But this misplaced hysteria has to be based on something, right? Why would otherwise rational parents, who wouldn’t dream of driving their kids unbuckled and out of their car seats, risk their health – and the health of their classmates – by not having them immunized?

Why do so many people, despite evidence to the contrary, still believe vaccinations are unsafe? (Canada’s immunization rate is reported to be 84 per cent; in parts of Southern Alberta, where there was a measles outbreak last year, it’s as low as 60 per cent.)

You can blame it partly on the infamous, now discredited 1998 study that linked the measles, mumps and rubella vaccine to autism. But that’s only part of the story. As Seth Mnookin writes in his excellent book about vaccination, The Panic Virus, otherwise well-educated, well-off, health-conscious parents are making deeply illogical decisions based on little more than a hunch and a whizz through Google. “When it comes to decisions around emotionally charged topics, logic often takes a back seat to what are called cognitive biases – essentially a set of unconscious mechanisms that convince us that it is our feelings about a situation and not the facts that represent the truth.”

A new study in the journal Pediatrics reinforces that exact point. A survey of almost 2,000 U.S. parents found that pro-vaccination messages were unpersuasive for those who already had doubts about immunization. In some cases, the pictures and stories of sick children, whose illnesses could have been prevented, actually reinforced their unfounded beliefs that vaccines were dangerous.

Reading between the lines, you can almost feel the researchers throwing up their hands. How do you deal with such intransigence? The Pediatrics team recommended that governments’ pro-vaccination messages should be better crafted, and that pediatricians, whom parents trust, should have a more central role in campaigns.

There are other methods of persuasion, some more carrot than stick. Australia, aiming for a 100-per-cent vaccination rate, announced plans to claw back tax breaks for parents who won’t immunize. Dr. Saunders, who I mentioned earlier, has written that his practice won’t accept patients if their parents aren’t having them vaccinated. This may seem drastic, but he writes that he has to think of the health of his other patients.

These are all fine if you believe in the “nudge” theory of influencing behaviour, but in this case, I’d argue we need more of a good old kick in the pants. If we penalize people for other behaviour that’s harmful to the public good – smoking in bars, not using car seats – then why would we not fine them for refusing to vaccinate their children? Under the law, you are not allowed to physically abuse your children – why should you be allowed to willfully expose them and others to easily prevented harm?

This would not be politically palatable, I’m sure, but then neither is the alternative: a bunch of kids who are sick and didn’t have to be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alpha v2 (Post 8437931)

lol

http://rnm.wikispaces.com/file/view/...5937/ingre.jpg

They forgot one of the worst: Facts About Dihydrogen Monoxide

Seriously, this shit is SO inflammatory and misleading.

(Yeah, some Ph.D wrote it... that's one. Vs. tens of thousands of others who disagree.)

(edit: Oh, I notice they list GENETICALLY MODIFIED yeast there... since GMOs are the latest boogie-man, so of course, that makes it EXTRA scary. It's hard to read the rest because it's so fuckin' small, but is there anything in there about radiation, irradiated stuffs, maybe the word "nuclear"? Cuz those words are sure to start a shitstorm the last couple years, too.)

(edit 2: Just managed to squint enough to read the bottom part... what is this guy's Ph.D. in, basket weaving? Lead pipes were a leading cause of the decline and fall of the Roman Empire? :lawl: pretty sure there are a few thousand historians who would have an issue with that. Fuck. You think if these anti-vaxxers' "science" held any water - sorry, DHMO - they'd have to resort to this kind of idiocy to try to scare people?)

Quote:

Originally Posted by threezero (Post 8437999)

EVERYTHING has side effects. 99.99% of the time THEY'RE NOT AS BAD AS THE DISEASE YOU'RE VACCINATING AGAINST. That's the thing that keeps getting glossed over: your chances of getting the disease are about 100 times higher than feeling any of the side effects, and about 10000 times higher than the chances of the side effects actually being worse that the disease.

It's like the idiots who don't wear their seatbelts because of the chance their car might go into a lake and they won't be able get it undone. :fulloffuck:

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8438004)

I suppose you watched that TED Talk, fact or fiction, talk yourself, how do you know what you're relaying here is in fact, fact?

And lastly how does a baby contract Hepatitis in your own words?

Which is more likely, a multinational conspiracy pushing the unnecessary Hepatitis B vaccine for infants or perhaps there are genuine benefits?

What are the benefits of the hepatitis B vaccine?

The hepatitis B vaccine (HBV) protects your child against the hepatitis B virus, which can lead to liver damage and even death.

Hepatitis B is generally considered an adult disease because it's known to be transmitted through unsafe sex and shared needles. But many who get it, including children, don't engage in these "high-risk" behaviors. They're either infected at birth or they contract the disease from close contact during childhood with others who are infected.

Hepatitis B is highly infectious. An estimated 800,000 to 1.4 million people in the United States have the virus, and 20 to 30 percent of them acquired the disease in childhood. Many of them never feel sick and don't know they have it, but those who become infected as children are more likely to have long-term health problems such as cirrhosis and liver cancer. About 3,000 Americans die from hepatitis B-related illnesses every year.

The HBV vaccine was introduced in 1981 and became part of the recommended immunization schedule in the United States in 1991. Since then, the incidence of acute hepatitis B has dropped by 94 percent in children and adolescents, and over 75 percent overall. The number of new infections per year has declined from an average of 260,000 in the 1980s to about 38,000 in 2010 with the biggest decline among children and adolescents.

This just about sums up how I feel about vaccinations.

http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net...znZDA_460s.jpg

Just a little anti-vaccine-related humour for everyone:

Jenny McCarthy: Anti-vaxxer gets remedied on Twitter.

Quote:

On Thursday, McCarthy asked a question of her fans on Twitter to see what they’d say. What she got was a dose of the reality she helped spawn.

Jenny McCarthy ✔ @JennyMcCarthy

What is the most important personality trait you look for in a mate? Reply using #JennyAsks

Really, she should’ve known what would happen. I would’ve expected a vast series of snarky retorts about vaccines… and I would’ve been right. But what they said exceeded my most fervent hopes. Here’s a selection of just a few I liked out of hundreds.

See the remarks for yourself.

CiC.... Mercury has been removed from vaccines for decades... Stop bringing up bullshit from your 30-40 year old archives. Might as well say electricity is the work of the devil. My ancestors from the 1800s said so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRS (Post 8438115)

This just about sums up how I feel about vaccinations.

http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net...znZDA_460s.jpg

Yummy mummy, would bang/10.