You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
The banners on the left side and below do not show for registered users!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.
Vancouver Off-Topic / Current EventsThe off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.
I was just stating my opinion from watching all these years, if you don't agree that's fine, but why turn it into a personal insult? And if you're going to do that, at least have the balls to back it up with something, where's your evidence of how "stupid" it is? Here I'll help you out with some actual numbers:
Be honest, how is he any worse? Especially considering he's played 2 years on marginal Canucks teams?
Both had great regular season performances and won over the loyalty of the fans. Both shit the bed at various points in the playoffs and neither one of them seemed like a long-term solution. I'm just being realistic with what we saw here. Schneider was 1-4 in playoff games here you might remember.
You guys are delusional living in the past if you think Schneider was any more of an answer to anything than Lack is. As far as the Canucks go, I think they both are the same answer to a question nobody wants to ask. Spelling it out -- neither one of them is a Stanley Cup goalie.
If you want stats look at Jmac's post. Pretty much sums up everything to a tee
lack, isnt as solid. he still has too much movement, and overplays at times. and people thought we should of got more for schnieder.
do you even know who was in the 2013 draft? mackinnon, barkov, drouin, jones, lindholm, monahan, nurse, ritsolainen, horvat, and nichuskin were the first 10 picks. outside of the top 2 this year, i wouldnt say the picks are worth a lot more, or more at all. we didnt get lucky at all with horvat.everyone knew he was gonna be a good nhler, they just didnt know, and still dont know if he can produce at a top line rate. come on guy.
Easy for you to say now after this season. Did you miss the months that went by where everyone was crying about Horvat's skating ability?
There's absolutely no such thing as a guaranteed NHL'er unless your name is Crosby or McDavid, for every one of those there are 5 Patrik Stefan's, so you "come on guy". Nobody knew all those players drafted were all going to turn out before that draft, if you think 2013 was as highly regarded as this years okay then. Hindsight is always 20/20 stop pretending everyone let alone you knew what would end up happening with any of those players.
If you want stats look at Jmac's post. Pretty much sums up everything to a tee
Yah it's awesome he had more time than me I'm on France right now, and I'm not being sarcastic he did a great summary.
Schneider stops 1 more shot every 3 games than Lack, it is important in the long run, I just don't see much of a difference between them skill wise. I see a huge difference between them perception wise. Lack is his own worst enemy as nobody takes him seriously because he's such a goofball, Schneider is a very serious guy and it comes through even when he's making joke videos with Luongo. There is no denying the fact Schneider played for way better Canucks teams than Lack has had the opportunity to.
I also stand by the fact neither one of them is a playoff goalie. I'm not even pumping Lack's tires here but people vastly overrated Schneider.
Lack is his own worst enemy as nobody takes him seriously because he's such a goofball, Schneider is a very serious guy and it comes through even when he's making joke videos with Luongo.
lolwut
What does being serious or being "a goofball" have anything to do with goalie skill?
I think that's something else called personality...
Later Rounds
De La Rose (33 GP, 6 P)
Duclair (18 GP, 7 P)
And then you have the guys still in juniors/minors like:
Nurse
Domi
Morrissey
Pulock
Rychel
Mantha
Poirier
Shinkaruk
McCarron
Theodore
Dickinson
Hartman
Bigras
Fucale
Zykov
Dauphin
Petan
Jarry
Bowie
Carrier
Comrie
Cassels
Bjorkstrand
Saros
Paul
Reway
who all look like they will be NHLers and who knows how many other, less-hyped prospects will become NHLers, too.
The only misses in the 1st round so far appear to be Gauthier and Klimchuk. Jury's still out on Morin, who has the size, but may not have the skating, hands, or IQ to be an NHLer (another Valabik, McIlrath, etc. possibly). Shinkaruk got off to a rough start to his pro career, but really started to play well down the stretch for Utica. Ended up outscoring uber-prospect Mantha.
As for 2015's class, it's hyped up pretty good. I know I'm not overly excited about the WHL's contributions in the later rounds as I was in past years. Even the guys from my Royals (Soy, Reddekopp) I'm pretty indifferent to. From what I've read, it's one of the weaker drafts from Europe, but the QMJHL is supposed to be stronger than usual and OHL is supposedly around average. Not sure about American contributions beyond the first round.
Easy for you to say now after this season. Did you miss the months that went by where everyone was crying about Horvat's skating ability?
Nobody knew all those players drafted were all going to turn out before that draft, if you think 2013 was as highly regarded as this years okay then. Hindsight is always 20/20 stop pretending everyone let alone you knew what would end up happening with any of those players.
actually those players were all basic guarantees to be successful, unless major injury. if you follow juniors, and pay attention, especially to their playoffs you'll generally see who has the chance to be an impact player.
yes horvat was slowish to start with, but its not like he had fucked up skating issues like fox. it was more disappointment as people wanted rookies in the lineup asap, when he was actually 2-3 years away, like many drafted players.
also this schnieder being serious crap, lack not and it making a difference. wtf you talking about. roy, hasek were crazy as fuck. brodeur not so much. doesnt matter if you are borderline crazy or a soft spoken serious guy. it depends on your skills which schnieder has more of.
The only misses in the 1st round so far appear to be Gauthier and Klimchuk. Jury's still out on Morin, who has the size, but may not have the skating, hands, or IQ to be an NHLer (another Valabik, McIlrath, etc. possibly). Shinkaruk got off to a rough start to his pro career, but really started to play well down the stretch for Utica. Ended up outscoring uber-prospect Mantha.
I'm not posting this as a knock against Shinkaruk, sounds like he's developing well in the minors. But Mantha hasn't been very good.
“Very, very, very disappointing,” Devellano told Keith Gave of Fox Sports. “And I say that with a lot of sadness. Coming out of junior, we had such high hopes for him.”
However, there is some optimism.
Quote:
“But honestly I’ve seen improvement in his game during the second half of the season. His reads are better, his positioning is better. He cut back on his penalties. He’s figuring out the mental aspect of it and that’s a good sign, a positive sign. But yeah, there’s times [they’d] like to see him more engaged, more aggressive. It shows up at times and then others it’s just not there. I think that’s why [Devellano] sounded so frustrated [after watching Mantha play three poor games in the AHL playoffs].
McIlrath that was a bad pick by Sather, I guess at the time it didn't look so bad though but still, taking him before Fowler
Mantha didn't play THAT bad, he still put up 15 goals and 33 points. Maybe compared to the complete and utter domination he demonstrated in juniors.
The point is that Shinkaruk looks like he'll be an NHLer. He only had 4 goals, 10 points at around the halfway point of the season and ended up finishing with 16 goals, 31 points by the end. He's been a regular throughout the playoffs, even with more experienced players returning from injury (though he has been demoted to the 4th line, limiting his ice time and ability to produce points). Compared to other prospects in Utica, Jensen has routinely found himself in the press box and McCann is yet to suit up for a game since joining Utica several weeks ago.
The McIlrath pick, at the time, I know a lot of experts hated that pick. I seem to recall Pierre McGuire being dumbfounded at how McIlrath was chosen before Fowler and Gormley, both of whom were expected to be top 5 picks.
ISS Top 30 from 2010. McIlrath wasn't even ranked in the top 30
# Name Pos Birthdate S/C Ht. Wt. Team League
1 Hall, Taylor LW 11/14/1991 L *6.00.5 185 Windsor OHL
2 Seguin, Tyler C 1/31/1992 R *6.01 172 Plymouth OHL
3 Gormley, Brandon D 2/18/1992 L *6.02 185 Moncton QMJHL
4 Tarasenko, Vladimir RW 12/13/1991 L 5.11 202 Novosibirsk KHL
5 Fowler, Cam D 12/5/1991 L *6.01.25 190 Windsor OHL
6 Niederreiter, Nino LW 9/8/1992 L *6.01.5 201 Portland WHL
7 Gudbranson, Erik D 1/7/1992 R *6.03.75 195 Kingston OHL
8 Johansen, Ryan C 7/31/1992 R *6.02 192 Portland WHL
9 Skinner, Jeffrey C 5/16/1992 L *5.10 187 Kitchener OHL
10 Forbort, Derek D 3/4/1992 L *6.04.5 198 Under 18 USHL
11 Merrill, Jonathan D 2/3/1992 L *6.03.25 198 Under 18 USHL
12 Watson, Austin RW 1/13/1992 R *6.03.25 185 Peterborough OHL
13 Connolly, Brett LW 5/2/1992 R 6.02 181 Prince George WHL
14 Burmistrov, Alexander C 10/21/1991 L *5.11.25 157 Barrie OHL
15 Granlund, Mikael C 2/26/1992 L 5.10 180 HIFK Helsinki FinE
16 Howden, Quinton LW 1/12/1992 L *6.02 182 Moose Jaw WHL
17 Pysyk, Mark D 1/11/1992 R *6.01.25 174 Edmonton WHL
18 Etem, Emerson C 6/16/1992 L *6.00.25 190 Medicine Hat WHL
19 Kuznetsov, Evgeny C 5/19/1992 L 6.00 172 Chelyabinsk KHL
20 Pitlick, Tyler C 11/1/1991 R 6.01.5 194 Mankato WCHA
21 Bjugstad, Nick C 7/17/1992 R *6.03.75 188 Blaine MN-HS
22 Sheahan, Riley C 12/7/1991 L 6.01.5 202 Notre Dame CCHA
23 Schwartz, Jaden C 6/25/1992 L *5.10 180 Tri-City USHL
24 Galiev, Stanislav C 1/17/1992 R *6.00.75 178 Saint John QMJHL
25 Tinordi, Jarred D 2/20/1992 L *6.05.5 205 Under 18 USHL
26 Nelson, Brock C 10/15/1991 L *6.02.5 205 Warroad MN-HS
27 Rensfeldt, Ludvig LW 1/29/1992 L *6.02.75 192 Brynas SJ18A
28 Coyle, Charlie RW 3/2/1992 R *6.01.5 202 South Shore EJHL
29 Larsson, Johan LW 7/25/1992 L *5.10 200 Brynas SJ18A
30 Zucker, Jason LW 1/16/1992 L *5.10.5 174 Under 18 USHL
I've seen nothing to indicate that Freddy 'The Goat' Gauthier is a miss. He may have been selected a little too early in the draft, but his numbers while winning the QMJHL Championship were decent, he manages to earn a spot on Team Canada, and has the size and IQ to make it in the NHL.
He's improved his defensive game (though still inconsistent) and still has quite a bit of potential. Keep in mind, he's just 22 years old.
What Benning said during an interview about Jensen's overall game and the fact that he's been a healthy scratch for several games now. With the emergence of Cassells, McCann, Shink etc. Jensen's stock has absolutely plummeted.
What does being serious or being "a goofball" have anything to do with goalie skill?
I think that's something else called personality...
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbaz
wtf you talking about. roy, hasek were crazy as fuck. brodeur not so much. doesnt matter if you are borderline crazy or a soft spoken serious guy. it depends on your skills which schnieder has more of.
Guys, can you both try reading a little harder? I said the perception of both of them is different due to their personalities, not their skill level.
If you don't know know what perception is you might want to look it up for no other reason than its kind of an important factor of everyone's life. Unless you're in a position where you never have to win anyone's favour that is.
What Benning said during an interview about Jensen's overall game and the fact that he's been a healthy scratch for several games now. With the emergence of Cassells, McCann, Shink etc. Jensen's stock has absolutely plummeted.
actually those players were all basic guarantees to be successful, unless major injury. if you follow juniors, and pay attention, especially to their playoffs you'll generally see who has the chance to be an impact player.
yes horvat was slowish to start with, but its not like he had fucked up skating issues like fox. it was more disappointment as people wanted rookies in the lineup asap, when he was actually 2-3 years away, like many drafted players.
Sorry but it's incorrect to say anyone is a basic guarantee to be an impact player. You could legitimately say they are all projected to be NHL players -- but that's a redundant statement since they wouldn't be in the draft and teams wouldn't pick them if they werent projected to be NHL players! I mean, there are 3 first overall draft picks in the last 20 years or so that never even played in the NHL let alone the myriad of them that never became impact players and that's just first overall picks. Heck, the Canucks themselves have drafted quite a few first rounders that never played in the NHL! With that "basic guarantee" Logic a first overall should be an impact player every time? I don't think so. I don't have time to go look through all the draft years maybe Jmac does but I bet you there's a shitload of guys who never played or did anything even in the top 10.
It's getting better with metrics and prospect camps and all the work teams put into their evaluations nowadays but come on... Nothing is a sure thing except for a couple exceptional players here and there. I bet you will even find a few people who have gotten a little nervous about McDavid after he so easily got shut down by Cassels in the playoffs. I think they'd be silly, but you can't discount the difference between an NHL game and everything below it.
Sorry but it's incorrect to say anyone is a basic guarantee to be an impact player. You could legitimately say they are all projected to be NHL players -- but that's a redundant statement since they wouldn't be in the draft and teams wouldn't pick them if they werent projected to be NHL players! I mean, there are 3 first overall draft picks in the last 20 years or so that never even played in the NHL let alone the myriad of them that never became impact players and that's just first overall picks. Heck, the Canucks themselves have drafted quite a few first rounders that never played in the NHL! With that "basic guarantee" Logic a first overall should be an impact player every time? I don't think so. I don't have time to go look through all the draft years maybe Jmac does but I bet you there's a shitload of guys who never played or did anything even in the top 10.
It's getting better with metrics and prospect camps and all the work teams put into their evaluations nowadays but come on... Nothing is a sure thing except for a couple exceptional players here and there. I bet you will even find a few people who have gotten a little nervous about McDavid after he so easily got shut down by Cassels in the playoffs. I think they'd be silly, but you can't discount the difference between an NHL game and everything below it.
didnt say anyone, said the top 10. as to why, you answered part of it yourself. advancements in scouting, media, technology, transportation, and training have made it so that predicting is much easier than it every used to be. not only from being able to view, or digest info more, but from the fact with these kids are now training harder at a younger age. because of this they are separating themselves from others. thus we now see less late round picks that become all-stars compared to much earlier years, where some unknown russian, or swedish player would be picked. oh and the other reason for being able to see why the top 10 in 2013 were all nhl capable, is because it was a fucking strong draft, which you can know by paying more attention to the different leagues.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRS
What makes you say that?
He's improved his defensive game (though still inconsistent) and still has quite a bit of potential. Keep in mind, he's just 22 years old.
honestly hes never had much upside, besides the run with the sedins late in the season ala jason king. he was always projected as a 3rd liner who can maybe slot in on the 2nd line at times, while having a weak defensive game. although he was technically picked around where he was ranked, he seemed like a hit or miss prospect. especially with saad, rattie, jurco, and jenner before or just after him.
hes been passed by cassels, mccann, virtanen, gaunce, shinkaruk, grenier for forward prospects. and also consider the younger forwards we have on the nhl roster in kenins, baertschi, horvat, and if you want to include kassian/vey(suspicions about kassian being gone as well too). hes been passed by too many who have better qualities than him imo.
although he scored while he played in europe, i feel hes just a player who benefited offensively from larger ice.
I love the Canucks Social Media Hype Machine leading to all these comments
but...i thought its been known that Jensen sucks.. didn't pan out the way the team really wanted him to. However, if the canucks development system is good, they will find a way to utilize him one way or another whether its in the AHL or at the NHL level.
You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
The banners on the left side and below do not show for registered users!
