Winter tire discussion for grown ups thread.

[Zedbra]

Originally Posted by SumAznGuy

For corning, studs don't affect it that much because most of the studs are usually towards the middle of the tire which doesn't affect the amount of contact patch with the outside edge of the tire.

Ah no - studs are usually always ONLY on the outside edges of the tires, to enable better contact in the middle of the tire for rain/traction etc.

Originally Posted by underscore

The studding must depend on the style of the tire, because I'm pretty sure the studded Hankooks I got for SnowX have most of them near the outside of the tire.

^ this is how almost all studded tires are, outside only.

[SumAznGuy]

Originally Posted by Zedbra

Ah no - studs are usually always ONLY on the outside edges of the tires, to enable better contact in the middle of the tire for rain/traction etc.



^ this is how almost all studded tires are, outside only.

My General's and my old Bridgestones were studded more to the middle of the tire. The inner and outer 1/4 of the tread patch has no studs.

[Zedbra]

Originally Posted by SumAznGuy

My General's and my old Bridgestones were studded more to the middle of the tire. The inner and outer 1/4 of the tread patch has no studs.

I'd like to know the models and have a look, it is certainly not the norm. Last 1/4 are no studs, of course not, that would rip/tear the rubber.

Anyways - I just realized that I have been running Toyo Garit KX tires on my Jetta the last two seasons and they have been an incredibly good tire in wet and snow/ice conditions. They have crushed walnut shells in them that 'supposedly' add traction and then when they fall out, act like many tiny sipes. Who knows how much marketing that is or not, but they grip anything.

Took my car out on the icy roads this morning and could only get the back to kick out if I came into a corner hard, tapped the brakes and pinned it. Gotta try, for science and and all.

[underscore]

^ thanked for your valuable contributions to the scientific community.

[Lomac]

The Hakka 8's actually have studs on the outer edge and center tread. Anyway, I opted to pick those up. A tad expensive, but I think they're going to be worth it.

[learn2manual]

So I bought a used car earlier this year and the owner gave me a set of Toyo Garit KXs with basically new tread on all 4 tires. The issue is that the tires were manufactured in 2007 and 2008...I have noticed the tires are bit hard when I feel them with my hand. I know that newer winter tires typically have a grippy feel.

Should I buy a brand new set of winter tires...when the existing tires are practically brand new with no cracking whatsoever?

[matrixfwd]

Were the tires stored inside, like in a garage? That would help extend its shelf life.

[westopher]

8 years is a long, long time. Have you driven on them? How do they feel? That will tell you more than we ever could.

[Jmac]

Depending where you read, the general advice is that tires "expire" after 5-10 years.

If they're roughly 8-9 years old, it may be a good idea to simply buy new ones.

[BillyBishop]

Decided to pick up some General Altimax Arctics after going through this thread. In my size they only come with a Q speed rating, whereas my OEM tire has a H speed rating.

I've read on a couple tire retailer websites that for winter tires it is acceptable to go down in speed rating. Is this true?

[FN-2199]

^Are you planning on consistently traveling >160km/h? If not, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
I've had my Altimax Arctics for years and have not had any problems driving for hours at high speeds (<160km/h)

[matrixfwd]

Apparently some folks
Say it may feel mushy, but it depends on your driving Style and your oem

[Euro7r]

Originally Posted by BillyBishop

Decided to pick up some General Altimax Arctics after going through this thread. In my size they only come with a Q speed rating, whereas my OEM tire has a H speed rating.

I've read on a couple tire retailer websites that for winter tires it is acceptable to go down in speed rating. Is this true?

They're noisy if you driving on the highway. This is just going at 80-110km. It does its job, can't complain for the price.

[whiteTDIpowa]

Gonna buy a new set of winter tires, help me decide between these two.

Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4

Or

Bridgestone LM32

Reviews and such both are awesome, what would you choose?

[roastpuff]

Whichever is cheaper! Hard to go wrong with those two.

[Z3guy]

I don't know understand why people think it is ok to buy cheap snow tires but reco expensive summer tires???? in the end it is the only contact patch you have.

I have never had Michelin, Pilot Alpin PA4s, but I am running Michelin Alpin PA3s and love them. Very soft and grippy tire in the snow.

[roastpuff]

Originally Posted by Z3guy

I don't know understand why people think it is ok to buy cheap snow tires but reco expensive summer tires???? in the end it is the only contact patch you have.

I have never had Michelin, Pilot Alpin PA4s, but I am running Michelin Alpin PA3s and love them. Very soft and grippy tire in the snow.

Z3guy, never meant to recommend 'cheap' snow tires - both of the ones that were listed are fairly pricey. In no way or manner would a Blizzak or a Pilot Alpin be considered cheap. Cheap to me = Linglong, Triangle, Federal, Nexen etc.

The performance difference between the LM-32 and the PA4 are quite small. I would be happy to run either of them, and have run older versions before. I only said whichever is cheaper because it's pretty much a coin toss between them in my opinion.

[Shorn]

I haven't ran Blizzaks before but I recently drove to Lillooet and Kamloops on a new set of Falken HS449 Eurowinters on a Civic. Cost about $590 tax in and including mount/balance.

They performed really well in my opinion. Drove through a storm on the Coquihalla on the way to Kamloops, and drove up Highway 12 to Lillooet (which is pretty sketchy in some places, single icy lane on the side of the mountain with a huge drop below). No complaints. There really wasn't any time when I wasn't confident in the tires ability.

They were a lot cheaper than Blizzaks and Michelin X-Ice, but for the money I thought they performed very well

[acrophobia]

A cheap tire, summer or winter, will be fine almost all of the time. They will do most of what you ask them to sufficiently. But, when shit hits the fan and you need to start/stop/maneuver quickly, you may end up pushing the tire past its capabilities. I value my personal safety and my family, so I buy tires that will give me the best odds of coming through in crunch time. Some folks don't have the $ for better tires, or they play the odds with cheap tires (and are very likely to be totally fine).

My grandpa lived hard and didn't give two shits about anything: smoked like a chimney, drank like a fish, no exercise, worked too much, and he lived to 75...odds be damned. Just like the guy that runs bald summer tires through every winter and comes out unscathed. But I'm a numbers guy, and I'll do what I can to stay around for as long as I can

[supafamous]

Among snow tires I don't think the diff between cheap and expensive is as tied to performance as summer tires are. Eg. Snow/ice traction/grip doesn't decline as quickly in a winter tire as it does as grip does in a cheap summer tire.

If you get a X-Ice instead of a Altimax Arctic you're getting better noise suppression, better ride, and better traction/grip in dry cold conditions but I'm not sure you'd see dramatically better snow/ice traction (at least not commensurate with the price increase).

Not advocating for cheap winters (especially Triangles and shit like that) but I think it's fine to purchase a 2nd tier brand for your winters like a Falken, Hankook, etc.

(For the record I use Blizzaks)

[threezero]

Serious discussion. We been having some pretty warm winters lately. Thinking about putting insurance back on the summer ride come feb. anybody else doing the same?

[underscore]

^ How warm though? My general rule is to not drive on summer tires below 10*C. Easy enough during the day in the early spring, but not so much in the evening or early morning.

Originally Posted by supafamous

Among snow tires I don't think the diff between cheap and expensive is as tied to performance as summer tires are. Eg. Snow/ice traction/grip doesn't decline as quickly in a winter tire as it does as grip does in a cheap summer tire.

Interesting, but I'd have to disagree. Just looking at the accident statistics, more people are finding the limits of their tires in the winter than in the summer. Driving down the road at the speed limit in the summer the only time most people would be finding a limit is during emergency braking. Do the same in the winter and you can easy be hitting limits when you're starting, turning, stopping normally, etc.

[Jmac]

Originally Posted by underscore

^ How warm though? My general rule is to not drive on summer tires below 10*C. Easy enough during the day in the early spring, but not so much in the evening or early morning.



Interesting, but I'd have to disagree. Just looking at the accident statistics, more people are finding the limits of their tires in the winter than in the summer. Driving down the road at the speed limit in the summer the only time most people would be finding a limit is during emergency braking. Do the same in the winter and you can easy be hitting limits when you're starting, turning, stopping normally, etc.

I think what he means is:
A $200 summer tire provides far superior traction to a $100 summer tire while a $200 winter tire traction provides somewhat superior traction to a $100 winter tire.

[supafamous]

Originally Posted by Jmac

I think what he means is:
A $200 summer tire provides far superior traction to a $100 summer tire while a $200 winter tire traction provides somewhat superior traction to a $100 winter tire.

Correct. No one should be embarrassed to buy a 2nd tier winter tire - it'll be plenty good (and kudos for even getting winters) and serve you plenty well compared to a top tier winter tire. It's still 80-90% of what a top tier winter tire is.

But cheap summer tires are kinda stupid. Might as well get an all-season tire. You're giving heaps of performance when you cheap out on a summer.

[Harvey Specter]

When are you guys planning to swap out the winters for summer tires? I'm getting new PSS and getting them installed next week but not sure if I should hold off or not.