Star Wars: Episode VII

[6o4__boi]

i started watching the clone wars a while back...at first i was like, why am i watching some kids show...but it gets pretty addicting.

i still haven't gotten around past season 3 though

has anyone seen the rebels animated show? how is that?

[DragonChi]

All 6 seasons of Clone Wars are on Netflix. I've watched them all, and really liked them.

the Clone Wars movie on the other hand, was terrible.

[StylinRed]

Originally Posted by Ronin

The Battle of Jakku sounds pretty badass...too bad we don't get to see it.

It's like that for a lot of shit. Remember all the adventures that Obi-wan and Anakin mention in passing in ep 2 and 3? Those sounded like way better movies than any of the material actually in the prequels

The trailer for the Battle of Jakku looks fantastic! (you get to play it in Star Wars Battlefront) but the actual gameplay is so limited

In the game The Battle of Jakku is played under "Turning Point" but there are no hero spawns, and only 1 at-st and 1 a-wing -_-

If you play the Jakku map under "Supremacy" mode it's awesome! lots of vehicle units (still no walkers though), heroes, large map, but you don't get a cinematic of a destroyer crashing in the background

[underscore]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

This article fills in the gaps that we're missing between Return of the Jedi and A New Hope 2

A complete guide to the new Star Wars canon before The Force Awakens | The Verge

the new Republic was formed after the Battle of Jakku, Mon Mothma is the leader (was also the leader of the Rebels)

The article helps settle a lot of questions, but it doesn't resolve all the issues with the film

Sounds like Disney is quickly turning Star Wars into another Marvel universe (where you have to read/watch a whole bunch of stuff to fully understand what's going on). Normally I'd be tempted, but considering all the flaws with 7 I'm not sure I want to bother subjecting myself to what could potentially be just as bad as 7.

Plus then a true Star Wars marathon will become a week long event in 5 different formats (movies, TV shows, video games, books and comics) and ain't nobody got time for dat!

[mako]

Those complaining are not true Star Wars fans.

Go back to Star Trek

[Tim Budong]

I watched this again... 3rd time..
Leia will become this

[StylinRed]

George Lucas's take

The first three movies had all kinds of issues. [Disney] looked at the stories and said we want to make something for the fans. So I said all I want to do is tell the story of what happened. You know, it started here and it went there. It's all about generations and it's about, you know, the issues of fathers and sons and grandfathers; it's a family soap opera. I mean, ultimately. We call it a space opera, but people don't realize it's actually a soap opera. And it's all about family problems — it's not about spaceships.

So, they decided they didn't want to use those stories. They decided they were going to go do their own thing, so I decided, fine, but basically I'm not going to try to... they weren't that keen to have me involved, anyway. But at the time I sad ... if I get in there, I'm just gonna cause trouble, because they're not gonna do what I want them to do, so. And I don't have the control to do that anymore, all I would do is muck everything up. So I said, okay, I will go my way, and I'll let them go their way.

And it really does come down to a really simple rule of life, which is when you break up with somebody, the first rule is no phone calls. The second rule, you don't go over to their house and drive by to see what they're doing. The third one is you don't show up at their coffee shop or the thing ... you just say: nope, gone, history — I'm moving forward... Every time you do something like that, you're opening the wound again, and it just makes it harder for you. You have to put it behind you, and it's a very, very hard thing to do. But you have to just cut it off and say okay, end of ball game, I got to move on. And everything in your body says, don't, you can't — these are my kids.

All those Star Wars films ... I loved them, I created them, I'm very intimately involved in them, and I sold them to the white slavers that take these things and uh, and ... [laughs]

George Lucas compares Disney to ?white slavers? that bought his children | The Verge


I guess even $4 billion + isn't enough to satisfy losing your baby

[thumper]

Spoilers/explanations from the book adaptation of the movie, past and present:

Spoiler!

YouTube (Short URL)

[Traum]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

George Lucas's take

George Lucas compares Disney to ?white slavers? that bought his children | The Verge

I guess even $4 billion + isn't enough to satisfy losing your baby

I'm just gonna say, nobody -- white slavers or not -- put a gun to Lucas' head and force him to sell off his "baby". He did so willingly, and he got a nice, big, fat deal out of it from Disney.

The least he could have done is to show some decency, and keep his comments to himself. In my book, what Lucas is doing now is no different than badmouthing an ex after they broke up.

What a jacka$$...

[Ronin]

Oh fuck off, George Lucas. They did a way better job than you did with your stupid prequel bullshit.

[carisear]

i'm not going to gloss over what lucas brought -- he was a pioneer in the 70s and 80s ... however that's also the last time he was relevant.

I think it's safe to say, that universally, no one cares what he says anymore.

[Vansterdam]

this movie delivered!! wish I saw it in Dbox though lol

so many feelZ

[underscore]

Before slamming Lucas I'd be curious to know what Disney originally agreed to do with the series vs what they actually did. It wouldn't surprise me if they're two very different things.

Originally Posted by Ronin

Oh fuck off, George Lucas. They did a way better job than you did with your stupid prequel bullshit.

The acting was better, the lines were better, but the story was terrible, and the story was the whole point of Star Wars.

[Ronin]

You think this story is worse than Senate bullshit this, emo-Anakin, Jar-Jar Binks bullshit that's in the prequels? There are way more plot holes in that trilogy.

[StylinRed]

at least the prequels were largely "original" whereas this new one is basically a remake

I can understand Lucas still critiquing everything coming out surrounding Star Wars, since this was his baby for 40+ years

In this particular case, Lucas is still on in an Advisory position albeit symbolically

It's like how parents can't stop being parents even though the kids have grown and moved away

[underscore]

Originally Posted by Ronin

You think this story is worse than Senate bullshit this, emo-Anakin, Jar-Jar Binks bullshit that's in the prequels? There are way more plot holes in that trilogy.

It's worse because it was all recycled from the previous movies and it disappointed me in a way I didn't even consider by doing that. I'll admit I haven't looked at the prequel trilogy critically in a long time but I don't recall any plot holes that were as big as some of the ones in 7. Love them or hate them the stories were far more unique than 7, which to me felt more like a reboot of the series than a sequel (I'd like 7 better if it was supposed to be a reboot of the series).

On top of that skimming through that link StylinRed posted up there and seeing some of the stuff they chose to keep as canon (I won't post any spoilers, but the second paragraph about The Clone Wars TV series? what the fuck is that?) makes me seriously shake my head.

I guess I'm also a bit annoyed that they had a story to work from and made the choice to throw it away and simply reuse movies we've already seen (while skipping over some things that would've been new and awesome to see) and I'm disappointed that I won't get to see the original vision for 7/8/9 presented on the big screen.

edit: I just read something that explains the lack of creativity, supposedly 6 months before filming (while pre-production had already started) Abrams had no script and had to rush to come up with something.

[Gumby]

Originally Posted by BBMme

Just started the starwars series with my gf. One episode down 5 more to go.

Uh which one did you start with? Hopefully 4, cuz then you can just pretend that 1-3 never existed.

Originally Posted by Vansterdam

this movie delivered!! wish I saw it in Dbox though lol

so many feelZ

I sat in the row directly in front of the Dbox seats and felt some of the rumbling.

[Tr1ll]

Originally Posted by underscore

On top of that skimming through that link StylinRed posted up there and seeing some of the stuff they chose to keep as canon (I won't post any spoilers, but the second paragraph about The Clone Wars TV series? what the fuck is that?) makes me seriously shake my head.

You need to watch The Clone Wars TV series if you haven't. Quite possibly the best cartoon show I've watched. So disappointed they cancelled it after 6 seasons.

[Lomac]

I'm okay with the EU being dismissed from canon. There are so many books, comics, games and whatever else that would had to have been worked around that creating a new story into that universe would have been, at best, very difficult. Of course there are existing stories that could have been used that would still have fit the new films, but the majority of them wouldn't have worked in either a logistics POV (most of the good stories are based on a time when the main characters are a lot younger) or from a big screen perspective. Thrawn would have been cool to see, but it wouldn't have made for a very exciting film. I would also have loved to see Mara Jade, but again, it's a few years too late. Sure, they could have adapted the Outbound Flight storyline and introduced the Chiss and the Yuuzhan Vong threat and I think that could have been a good three movie series. However, you're still having to play around with other existing stories in order to move the timeline to a later date and that would play havoc with it. And if that was the case, you'd still have people bitching about how things were no longer canon.

[unit]

without reading all the opinions in the thread, all i can say is i disliked the movie mostly.
i did notice all the re-used concepts in the movie... droid sent away with important info, empire looks for it... jakku looks just like tatooine, the new palpatine-like emperor, another death star destroyed... also finn fighting and actually giving kylo ren a tough time a few times, despite never previously touching a light saber...
also i did appreciate the light saber battles looking a little less cartoonish, but there just wasnt enough of it for me. understandable though since there weren't really any jedi masters around to train anyone..

my least fav star wars yet.. if it wasnt for rey being eye candy i prob wouldnt try watching it again.

[RFlush]

I enjoyed and liked episode 7, but I can see where the people who say it's a direct copy are coming from.

Imagine if episode 7 was released one year after episode 6, people would be complaining non stop.

[Gumby]

Originally Posted by RFlush

I enjoyed and liked episode 7, but I can see where the people who say it's a direct copy are coming from.

Imagine if episode 7 was released one year after episode 6, people would be complaining non stop.

Good thing episode 7 was released 30+ years after episode 6, and more importantly, after episodes 1-3.

[Gumby]

Another theory on who is Rey related to... (long-ish read)

Spoiler!

Taken from https://medium.com/@benostrower/rey-...i-362b5af09849:

[Spoilers ahead — but really the movie’s been out for more than 1o days. Why are you reading Star Wars analysis if you haven’t seen the movie yet?]

Who is Rey?

Like much of the world last weekend, I had the sincere pleasure of seeing a brand new Star Wars movie. For an entire weekend (and two viewings) my younger brother and I regressed back to our pre-adolescent (and adolescent) selves, relishing the escape from our now very adult lives and responsibilities. For us, as with many others, much of our childhood was spent trying to answer life’s big questions: does Princess Leia become a Jedi? Do she and Han go on to have children? If so, do they become Jedis? What was Obi Wan doing during his 30 years in hiding? Yadda yadda. The list of exciting mysteries is endless. It was always these many unanswered and endless open narrative questions, misdirections and the potential for surprise twists (“Luke, I am your father”) that made Star Wars extra special and filled our daydreams with plenty of great raw material. I even wrote a final paper in high school that was bookended by references to the mythical tropes of the Original Trilogy. I’ve done a lot of thinking about this…

While there are dozens of new questions posed about our beloved galaxy in The Force Awakens, the “white whale” is who is Rey’s family? If you’re reading this, you’ve probably already seen the movie, so I won’t make a case for why this is so important — just that we all know how key parentage is to the whole saga. It’s the theme of lineage and the passage of the godly force that elevates this series to modern mythology…

I left the theater after my first (and even second) viewing entirely convinced that Rey is Luke Skywalker’s daughter. Duh. All signs point to this (the inheritance of the lightsaber, Maz Kanata’s cryptic insights, the final scene with Luke, etc). After all, the whole story is about the sins and redemptions of the Skywalker family, right?

Not so fast. After days of marinating, I’m convinced: that was all misdirection — too narratively easy for what should be the biggest reveal in this new trilogy. In the following post, I’ll make a reasoned case that Rey is in fact Obi Wan Kenobi’s granddaughter — both because of clues planted in The Force Awakens and especially because it would bring the nine episode series to a much more satisfying emotional conclusion; lending more poignance to the earlier films, including the maligned Prequels.

First, the clues:

The accent

The only two “good guys” in the entire series who have British accents are Obi Wan and Rey (if you exclude C3PO). This likely isn’t an accident since other British actors (i.e. John Boyega, Liam Neeson) perform with American accents.

The Jedi mind trick scene

The scene in which Rey persuades her Stormtrooper (007) captor to open her cell door and drop his weapon strongly echoes Obi Wan’s successful uses of the Jedi mind trick in both the OT and Prequels — one of his signature abilities. This is not the plot twist you’re looking for.

Poking around Starkiller Base

The scenes of Rey scaling the walls and tiptoing around the First Order’s Starkiller HQ echo Obi Wan in A New Hope sneaking around the Death Star and disabling the tractor beam. A superficial homage to Episode IV or a breadcrumb leading to answers about the Third Trilogy’s protagonist?

“Ben Solo”

The only reference to Obi Wan in The Force Awakens comes with the reveal of Kylo Ren’s real name: Ben. That climactic moment serves to highlight two key things: 1) a reminder of the overall importance of “Old Ben” Kenobi to the broader Star Wars story, and 2) the notable absence of any references to Obi Wan up until that moment — the only major A New Hope character not to get a prior visual cameo or major plot point (so we think). This omission looks like a filmmaker’s “sleight-of-hand,” guiding us away from a reveal about Obi Wan later in the new trilogy.

But the clues continue to pile up, addressed here: https://www.youtube.com/embed/4mjFfdrTJrQ

Similar costumes between Rey and Obi Wan (in the Prequels).
Both Ewan McGregor’s and Alec Guinness’s voices appear in the key basement lightsaber flashback scene at Maz’s: Ewan McGregor and Frank Oz Are in 'The Force Awakens'
And, lastly, JJ Abrams has suggested that Rey’s loneliness is a key to her origin, likely a referencing Obi Wan’s status as a lonely hermit between Episodes 3 and 4. Unless Rey is Yoda’s granddaughter, but probably not.

Sure, these are all basic clues that could easily be discounted, but there’s ample fodder with which to rack your brain…

The deeper strain of this “Rey Kenobi theory,” however, is rooted in the concept that Star Wars has always had a certain narrative symmetry: good versus evil, light versus dark, small versus big, faith versus technology. Characters even refer to bringing “balance to the force.” These patterns abound in the Star Wars universe, appearing again and again in both minor and major ways. Many have even been critical of how closely The Force Awakens mirrors earlier narrative patterns and beats. That criticism is fair, but it’s being used for intentional effect to both guide and misguide and play with our assumptions and expectations.

With that said, here are the juicier reasons why Rey being Obi Wan’s granddaughter would ring true and be so satisfying to the completion of the story:

Symbolism of the lightsaber

While the movie seems to imply that Rey’s inheritance of Luke’s blue lightsaber is a ”passing of the torch” from one Skywalker to another, we shouldn’t forget who gave Luke that lightsaber in the first place: Obi Wan. The lightsaber had been in Obi Wan’s possession for 20–30 years or so between Episodes 3 and 4, and is even presented to Luke from a wood chest similar to the chest later seen in Episode 7 in Maz Kanata’s castle-bar (yet another clue). It is Obi Wan’s passage of the lightsaber to Luke, along with encouragement to learn the force that propels the entire story forward. This key scene in Episode 4 (arguably the most important scene in all seven movies) even includes Obi Wan’s misdirection about Luke’s father, a narrative trick repeated in The Force Awakens. All that being said, think about how much more poignant Episode 7's final scene of Rey handing Luke his own lightsaber becomes if it’s again a Kenobi reuniting a Skywalker with their weapon, compelling them back to the fight. Of course we all know that the burden of the lightsaber is now Rey’s whether she wants it or not…

Reversal of the mentors

It wouldn’t be wild speculation to assume that Luke will now train Rey in the ways of the Jedi in Episode 8. If Rey is a Kenobi (admit it, you’re convinced), this would be a profound and emotional reversal of the role of mentor and teacher: a Kenobi training a Skywalker followed by a Skywalker training a Kenobi. Narrative symmetry.

Parallels to Kenobi vs. Skywalker duels

Both Episodes 3 and 4 end with fateful duels between Obi Wan and Anakin/Darth. While there are certainly duels between Skywalkers (5 and 6), I’d suggest that Rey and Kylo Ren’s duel at the end of 7 becomes much more dramatic if we eventually learn that they are refighting the battle of their grandfathers, not two battling cousins or siblings.

Depth of Obi Wan as a character

One obvious question that grows from the “Rey Kenobi theory” is: with whom would Obi Wan have had a child? When? Like monks, aren’t Jedi’s supposed to resist attachments? Despite Obi Wan’s significant role in the first six movies, we know surprisingly little about him and what makes him tick. A backstory (uncultivated in I, II & III) about a forbidden love, perhaps, can enrich and deepen his character in surprising ways. It might answer another question: what was Obi Wan doing while in hiding for those 20–30 years before finally connecting with Luke on Tatooine? Maybe he wasn’t the lonely hermit that we thought.

The twist of the series

Assuming that Rey isn’t just the hero of this new trilogy, but also the character that ultimately brings “balance to the force”, the reveal that Rey is a Kenobi and not a Skywalker, as we’re being led to believe, would be the twist of the entire nine episode arc.

We’re told at many points in the Prequels that Anakin Skywalker was “the chosen one” — the Jedi who would bring balance to the force. Not only was this obviously false, but in Episode 7 we’ve essentially learned that Luke has also failed miserably in his attempt to bring peace to the galaxy. Luke’s Jedi training of Ben Solo (a Skywalker descendant) was clearly such a disaster that it turned him to the dark side. In all, the Skywalkers are a pretty mixed bag: powerful, but emotional, petulant and frequently tempted by the allure of evil. It’s Ben Kenobi in the earlier episodes that is truly virtuous, noble and pure of heart. He’s our true hero. He’s incorruptible. He sacrifices himself at the end of A New Hope to show Luke the power of faith in the force, saving him and the galaxy in the process. Wouldn’t it then make complete narrative sense for a Kenobi (Rey) to be the true hero of the saga — perhaps even saving the soul of another conflicted Skywalker (Ben Solo/Kylo Ren) later in the new trilogy? How satisfying would that be to learn that the nine episode arc is really, underneath it all, about the Kenobi family and not the Skywalkers?

My favorite moment in the series comes in Episode 5 when Luke has abruptly and hastily cut short his training and Force Ghost Obi Wan laments, “That boy is our last hope.” Yoda replies, “No…there is another…”

Written originally to be a reference to Leia, how dramatic would it be for the “another” to ultimately mean a Kenobi? After all, we do learn pretty quickly in Episode 7 that Leia never becomes a Jedi. If Rey is a Kenobi and if by the close of Episode 9 she’s brought “balance to the force,” then all of the previous movies take on a new meaning. Even Obi Wan’s Force Ghost from Episodes 5 and 6 takes on a much more spiritual purpose than to just provide convenient story exposition. If Rey is revealed as a Kenobi, it changes the entire paradigm of the series.

[Ronin]

Originally Posted by underscore

It's worse because it was all recycled from the previous movies and it disappointed me in a way I didn't even consider by doing that. I'll admit I haven't looked at the prequel trilogy critically in a long time but I don't recall any plot holes that were as big as some of the ones in 7. Love them or hate them the stories were far more unique than 7, which to me felt more like a reboot of the series than a sequel (I'd like 7 better if it was supposed to be a reboot of the series).

On top of that skimming through that link StylinRed posted up there and seeing some of the stuff they chose to keep as canon (I won't post any spoilers, but the second paragraph about The Clone Wars TV series? what the fuck is that?) makes me seriously shake my head.

I guess I'm also a bit annoyed that they had a story to work from and made the choice to throw it away and simply reuse movies we've already seen (while skipping over some things that would've been new and awesome to see) and I'm disappointed that I won't get to see the original vision for 7/8/9 presented on the big screen.

edit: I just read something that explains the lack of creativity, supposedly 6 months before filming (while pre-production had already started) Abrams had no script and had to rush to come up with something.

Originality is overrated. Originality is just undetected plagiarism. Every artist steals.

I'd rather watch a fucking awesome movie that steals a good story than an original movie that's goddamn awful.

Apart from just being Star Wars retold, they nailed everything about the way Star Wars is supposed to look and feel while making it modern.

[winson604]

Heck I enjoyed my time watching Ep 7 and that's all I really care about.

For me personally, the first and most important thing I seek from any movie is to be entertained. If the acting was weak or the story was weak I can live with it as long as I'm entertained. If the acting and or story was great too then bonus. The exception is when I go into a movie actually expecting and seeking all or a combination of the above but it doesn't deliver.

For Star Wars all I wanted was to be entertained and have a bit of that nostalgic feeling and it delivered.