BMW M2 is here

[Alpine]

Originally Posted by Z3guy

I lost interest in m cars after the f10 m5. The m4 is nice, but I would rather have an used 991s. Imo, the m2 looks absolutely fantastic. The m2 weight and the proportions makes the m4 look like a huge boat. I would like a loaded manual blue one!

Sadly there is no weight differnce between the m2 m3 and m4... They all weigh within 50lbs of each other. Silly bmw.

[westopher]

Originally Posted by Alpine

Wow, curb weight of 3450lbs or 3500lbs... And people said the mustangs/camaros/challengers were pigs lol.

Thats literally 600/650 lbs less than the challenger. Or 15% less weight. Invalid point is invalid.

[TOPEC]

like the M6 grandcoupe, this will be a M car that wont come with a LSD

[68style]

Originally Posted by westopher

I can't believe people aren't excited about this. Most awesome car released since the GT4.
This is literally the only new car I would consider buying.

It's the feel....... I don't bother bringing it up with most people, because maybe I'm old (I don't think backup cameras and blindspot recognition systems etc. are cool) but I will bring it up with you because I think you totally get it based on what I know about you -- the feel is all gone. Have you driven a M235i? I would expect the dynamics are roughly the same... it's so neutered. Yah it's fast and I'm sure it handles great and stops on a dime... but the whole experience leaves me feeling like "Who cares?" afterwards. That high door sill/low seat position where you'd have to put your elbow over your head to hang an arm out an open window and a steering wheel that has about as much feedback as a GT5 wheel mounted to your coffee table............... there's no emotional connect. These cars are like one night stands... they're a great ride for the night and exciting to fool around with... but in the morning, you just want them gone and go back to your E36 or whatever else you had before.

[westopher]

I definitely agree with you on that. For me it comes down to, am I willing to sacrifice the old feel for new creature comforts, warranty, emissions and more importantly safety? As someone who has been in a pretty serious crash, safety is paramount, and you just can't compete with new cars. A car like this may have lost some feel with the electronic LSD, electronic steering, drive by wire etc, but I doubt its not a fun car still. I'm not moving to a newer car, but I can certainly understand the reasoning. This seems like they are really doing their best to keep up that old feel and still be able to sell cars.

[JoshuaWong]

Originally Posted by Z3guy

I lost interest in m cars after the f10 m5. The m4 is nice, but I would rather have an used 991s. Imo, the m2 looks absolutely fantastic. The m2 weight and the proportions makes the m4 look like a huge boat. I would like a loaded manual blue one!

My thoughts exactly, although I don't really care about the weight. From my experience its more about how they "cope" with the weight. People shouldn't be so hung on about the weight. I driven plenty of car that "feel" similar in weight but they are not. Doesn't bother me one bit.

As for the manual option, I was one of the first to go for the DCT in my circle of friends... now they almost all migrated to the DCT from manual if thats saying something.

One of my uncle who had manual for all his past cars E36 Euro, E28 M5, E39 M5, B8 S4, EK9, just recently got the DCT for his F80 M3 and loving every bit... never looked back

I'm sure this will be a great car, as is typical M... some might argue its less exciting than past M cars, but its just different car for different times.

[StylinRed]

Originally Posted by Alpine

Wow, curb weight of 3450lbs or 3500lbs... And people said the mustangs/camaros/challengers were pigs lol.

The RCF weighs 4000lbs and people bitch about it non-stop, but it's a NA 5.0l V8 with 470hp and 390lb-ft of torque throw some turbos on that and (lexus is supposedly coming out with a 600+hp twin turbo version for 2017)

[boostfever]

Originally Posted by jasonturbo

Been waiting to see how this potentially impacts the value of the 1M which I feel is severely overpriced.

and less attractive looking.
1M is a great fun car to drive though, and probably lighter than the M2. However, the 1-Series generally wasn't the best looking Bimmer out of Munich in the past decade.

[nsx042003]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

The RCF weighs 4000lbs and people bitch about it non-stop, but it's a NA 5.0l V8 with 470hp and 390lb-ft of torque throw some turbos on that and (lexus is supposedly coming out with a 600+hp twin turbo version for 2017)

They said that stuff when the ISF was out. that was when...2008? All depends on how many they sell...and I doubt it will be many....with the ugly of that car

M2...i still prefer the look of the M4, still looks squished like the 1 series was.

[Z3guy]

Originally Posted by JoshuaWong

My thoughts exactly, although I don't really care about the weight. From my experience its more about how they "cope" with the weight. People shouldn't be so hung on about the weight. I driven plenty of car that "feel" similar in weight but they are not. Doesn't bother me one bit.

As for the manual option, I was one of the first to go for the DCT in my circle of friends... now they almost all migrated to the DCT from manual if thats saying something.

One of my uncle who had manual for all his past cars E36 Euro, E28 M5, E39 M5, B8 S4, EK9, just recently got the DCT for his F80 M3 and loving every bit... never looked back

I'm sure this will be a great car, as is typical M... some might argue its less exciting than past M cars, but its just different car for different times.

My previous E60 M5 and my current E93 M3 weigh about the same at 4000lbs and the only major difference was the wheelbase, engine overhang, and width. However, my M3 is way more enjoyable to drive, more nimble, and way more tossable Vs my E60 M5 which was just an under steering pig that once you choose your line through a turn that was it. Completely different driving experience even thought they weighed about the same......

[StylinRed]

Originally Posted by nsx042003

They said that stuff when the ISF was out. that was when...2008? All depends on how many they sell...and I doubt it will be many....with the ugly of that car

really eh? i only started paying attention when the rc was coming out, and saw the supposed leak of their timeline, who knows, would be awesome

M2...i still prefer the look of the M4, still looks squished like the 1 series was.

the m2 looks nice from that front angle but the sides etc make it look meh, m4 does still look better i agree, even still they all look the same -_-

[Z3guy]

Originally Posted by Alpine

Sadly there is no weight differnce between the m2 m3 and m4... They all weigh within 50lbs of each other. Silly bmw.

the absolute weight is important, but how the weight is distributed is important as well.....how low is the centre of gravity?, how far forward does the engine hang off the front axle? how the weight is transferred to the rear wheels, etc.

[teggy604]

Originally Posted by 68style

It's the feel....... I don't bother bringing it up with most people, because maybe I'm old (I don't think backup cameras and blindspot recognition systems etc. are cool) but I will bring it up with you because I think you totally get it based on what I know about you -- the feel is all gone. Have you driven a M235i? I would expect the dynamics are roughly the same... it's so neutered. Yah it's fast and I'm sure it handles great and stops on a dime... but the whole experience leaves me feeling like "Who cares?" afterwards. That high door sill/low seat position where you'd have to put your elbow over your head to hang an arm out an open window and a steering wheel that has about as much feedback as a GT5 wheel mounted to your coffee table............... there's no emotional connect. These cars are like one night stands... they're a great ride for the night and exciting to fool around with... but in the morning, you just want them gone and go back to your E36 or whatever else you had before.

pretty much sums it up. all the cars now a days are just disposable after a few years. E30 M3 less is more.

[Z3guy]

^ I would have to respectfully disagree with you, the E30 M3 drives like shit! heck, the 87/88 325is drove 10x better than an E30 M3. Unless you rev the shit out of the thing, a stock Camry would kick your arse.

[JoshuaWong]

Originally Posted by Z3guy

^ I would have to respectfully disagree with you, the E30 M3 drives like shit! heck, the 87/88 325is drove 10x better than an E30 M3. Unless you rev the shit out of the thing, a stock Camry would kick your arse.

Interesting to hear you say that, but I'm sure there are a LOT of preconceptions running wild on the internet. Lots of people who never drove the car, simply passing on the experience shared by other supposed "drivers".

Case in point, I never got the hype about the 1M. TONS of people hyped over it and swear by it and defend it to the death still. To me its not that special, several prominent race drivers have said the same about the car.

But, I guess it couldn't hurt with the way its price is going. Buy it new, drive it, dump it and not lose any money is always a good thing.

[westopher]

E30 m3 is a car for the most tolerant of enthusiasts. Its a high reward car when you can flog it, but if you aren't flogging it all the time I can see it being frustrating.

[Z3guy]

in the day, most M car guys traded in their e30 M3s for the substantially more enjoyable E36 M3s....who doesn't like the torque from the inline 6.......

[westopher]

Find me someone who wants to make that trade plz.
Having both would be perfect though.

[Z3guy]

I remember in the early to mid 90s people couldn't off load their E30 M3 for $15K and E36 M3s were selling above the MSRP of $63K. I wanted an Estoril blue/white interior e36 M3 so badly....but my wallet only allowed me to get an 94 E36 318is. In 94, I had a chance to buy a low km a real racing dynamics E30 M3 for $20K, but I thought the 318 was a better car! man, was I stupid! haha?

[JoshuaWong]

Its a case of ever changing times. Always interesting when history looks back and re-judge the past with contemporary eyes. Same with fashion, politics, design, values.

My uncle loved the E36 M3 Euro and still sing high praises for it, when I started to know about cars I was always under the impression the E36 was one of the underdogs. One of my mom's friend sold her E30 M3 for next to nothing years back. She also had a Ferrari Daytona back in the days, of course, that car is rubbish by today's eyes.

I am curious how history will judge the E92 and F80...

[Z3guy]

My gut tells me an e92 manual m3 will eventually appreciate not because it is rare or anything but because it was end of the high revving na era. Similar to the 993 I think the f80 will have the same fate as the 996 unfortunately

[white rocket]

Kinda cool I guess. Actually fuck it, it's not. I feel like the "M" badge has been tossed around by BMW like a Thai hooker so I'm kind of anesthetized to anything they come out with. The more car manufacturers come out with new, exciting, revolutionary automobiles I find myself loving the older stuff more and more. If my neighbor bought one and showed up one day with it, I'd take one look at my ITR in the garage and think "thank God" : phew:

In defense of the 1M, it's the rarity of the car that boasts the excitement overall. Yeah, the car is nice and has that toss-ability to it but it's nothing crazy or out of this world. I like the fact that BMW made a car that eclipsed the M3 slightly then they discontinued it fearing it would eat into their M3 sales. THAT is cool and worth noting; hence the current price tag for a pre-owned one.

The E30 M3 has no business being discussed or compared to anything in today's current market as it is a completely different animal. It rewards those with the balls to drive it how it's meant to be driven. It is NOT an instant gratification car at all. An awesome car but not awesome for everybody.

[ZN6]

Originally Posted by 68style

It's the feel....... I don't bother bringing it up with most people, because maybe I'm old (I don't think backup cameras and blindspot recognition systems etc. are cool) but I will bring it up with you because I think you totally get it based on what I know about you -- the feel is all gone. Have you driven a M235i? I would expect the dynamics are roughly the same... it's so neutered. Yah it's fast and I'm sure it handles great and stops on a dime... but the whole experience leaves me feeling like "Who cares?" afterwards. That high door sill/low seat position where you'd have to put your elbow over your head to hang an arm out an open window and a steering wheel that has about as much feedback as a GT5 wheel mounted to your coffee table............... there's no emotional connect. These cars are like one night stands... they're a great ride for the night and exciting to fool around with... but in the morning, you just want them gone and go back to your E36 or whatever else you had before.

Couldn't agree more. On paper and the performance of the car is so far removed from the actual driver skill that you'd have to drive it at 1/10ths at a time and that it's not exciting to drive at legal speeds.

For me it's always been leaps and bounds more fun driving a slow car fast than a fast car slow.

[underscore]

Originally Posted by westopher

I definitely agree with you on that. For me it comes down to, am I willing to sacrifice the old feel for new creature comforts, warranty, emissions and more importantly safety? As someone who has been in a pretty serious crash, safety is paramount, and you just can't compete with new cars.

If you want safety, the 02-05 4Runner (N210), 7 series (E6*) and G35 (V35) statistically have the fewest fatalities per capita out of any vehicles.

[AstulzerRZD]

Originally Posted by E-40six

did everyone absolutely miss the MANUAL gear box that is standard on this thing or what?

The standard manual transmission also comes with mandatory revmatching unless you're in Sport+, where the throttle becomes quite sensitive.