Electric and Hybrid Car Thread

[JDMDreams]

^^ I guess time will tell, give them another year or 2 and see what happens

[AstulzerRZD]

Final stats on my time with Jeep Wrangler 4XE Willys (M/T Tires)

Stated electric range: 21mi, ~30km
Achieved electric range: ~26mi, ~42km
14.5kwh "all electric" battery, 2.5kwh reserved for hybrid operation.

$14 in charging for 426mi, 681km.
Including free overnight charging at Amazon/Childrens Hospital, $0.5/hr 6kwh at work.

Vancouver Weekend Driving: 168km electric, 69km gas, 5h54, 6.3L/100km
includes trip from border to Richmond

Seattle City Driving (8 days): 218mi electric, 44.3mi gas, 6.1L/100km
includes trip from border to Seattle

Highway only mileage: 11.2L/100km

Overall: 1288 km, 426 mi electric, 379 mi on gas, 7.4L/100km
includes round trip to Vancouver

I think this is representative - tooling around town during the weekday and a weekend road trip.

What are people getting out of the X5 45/50e and RAV4 Prime?

[JDMDreams]

Highway only mileage: 11.2L/100km

I have v8s that do better than this and how comfortable are you in a Jeep on long highway trips

Also that sounds like you did a lot of charging if it's only 40 km EV range?

[AstulzerRZD]

Originally Posted by JDMDreams

Highway only mileage: 11.2L/100km

I have v8s that do better than this and how comfortable are you in a Jeep on long highway trips

Also that sounds like you did a lot of charging if it's only 40 km EV range?

tbh I expected way worse but I think the amt of shit ppl give wranglers is exaggerated, my mom/sister could drive this and not complain.
steers, turns, goes great and rides fine on the highway.
seats better than RAV4, top on quieter than RAV4 on the Sahara (Willy MT tires was awful).

Fuel economy wise... top off on a brick, 5300 lbs, 130kmh cruising, mud terrain tires, 33inch, and zero aerodynamic focus on the underbody will do this.
I got about the same in the Grand Cherokee 4xe but cruising speed was also 155kmh with fair amt of hills.

Charging wise, basically charged it everywhere I went. Was luck that all the spots I go to seemed to have chargers.

Vancouver:
Home: L1 gets to 90% in 10ish hours.
Gym: South Arm has 2 L2 chargers.
Downtown: It's an extra $1.50 to park somewhere with 4 hours of free L2 charging (6/7.2kwh chargers).

Seattle
Home: Free charging at Seattle Children's or Amazon Offices after 4PM, 6kwh
Work: 0.5c/Hr at 6kwh
Food/Dinner: Seattle has streetside chargers where the cable comes down from the sky lmao. 21c/kwh, 10kwh

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

Final stats on my time with Jeep Wrangler 4XE Willys (M/T Tires)

Stated electric range: 21mi, ~30km
Achieved electric range: ~26mi, ~42km
14.5kwh "all electric" battery, 2.5kwh reserved for hybrid operation.

$14 in charging for 426mi, 681km.
Including free overnight charging at Amazon/Childrens Hospital, $0.5/hr 6kwh at work.

Vancouver Weekend Driving: 168km electric, 69km gas, 5h54, 6.3L/100km
includes trip from border to Richmond

Seattle City Driving (8 days): 218mi electric, 44.3mi gas, 6.1L/100km
includes trip from border to Seattle

Highway only mileage: 11.2L/100km

Overall: 1288 km, 426 mi electric, 379 mi on gas, 7.4L/100km
includes round trip to Vancouver

I think this is representative - tooling around town during the weekday and a weekend road trip.

What are people getting out of the X5 45/50e and RAV4 Prime?

X5 45e, from my research and also from our test drive, the car is rated for 50km EV. On our longish test drive where we jaunted it around the city at a pretty spirited pace and also took it down Knight Street bridge freeway from Bridgeport to Westminster Hwy twice, at our pace it would probably have been around 35km EV.

You can flash the car as in North America the battery is only usable to 60% or something. It's recommended to flash it to 80 or 90% usable. Around town no highway 3rd hand info it can get 75km and still have about 10% left.

I don't know how the PRIME does, but my brother has a NX450h which is basically NX Prime. He said he can get about 60km on a full charge and he fills up once every 5000km or so. So really only when he takes it on a road trip.

[Badhobz]

Too friggin complex marrying both electrical and ICE technologies into one depreciating asset.

But i guess it’s just like the normal Toyota hybrid but with a bigger battery pack. The normal Toyota hybrids have been basically bulletproof.

Though im sure not running the gas for 5000kms can’t be good for the ICE part of the car.

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

Too friggin complex marrying both electrical and ICE technologies into one depreciating asset.

But i guess it’s just like the normal Toyota hybrid but with a bigger battery pack. The normal Toyota hybrids have been basically bulletproof.

Though im sure not running the gas for 5000kms can’t be good for the ICE part of the car.

TBH I'm not sure either. Depending on usage, when I DO buy that 45e, I might just never fill it up and let it slosh around. Plus it's a weight savings of about 80lbs lol

[AstulzerRZD]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

X5 45e, from my research and also from our test drive, the car is rated for 50km EV. On our longish test drive where we jaunted it around the city at a pretty spirited pace and also took it down Knight Street bridge freeway from Bridgeport to Westminster Hwy twice, at our pace it would probably have been around 35km EV.

You can flash the car as in North America the battery is only usable to 60% or something. It's recommended to flash it to 80 or 90% usable. Around town no highway 3rd hand info it can get 75km and still have about 10% left.

I don't know how the PRIME does, but my brother has a NX450h which is basically NX Prime. He said he can get about 60km on a full charge and he fills up once every 5000km or so. So really only when he takes it on a road trip.

Yeah the 60-70km range is a must tbh.
I frequently ran out of range on 35-40km running errands in Seattle.

Interesting how the 50e gets better highway fuel economy than the 45e ... a more modern charging rate also needed for the larger battery.

[dark0821]

We run the prime ICE engine once a week, if no road trips, a tank lasts us more than a year... but yea, we now keep it around 1/5 tank because gas gets bad even with stablizer... so when the time comes 4/5 of a tank of good gas to blend into the last 1/5 tank...

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

Yeah the 60-70km range is a must tbh.
I frequently ran out of range on 35-40km running errands in Seattle.

Interesting how the 50e gets better highway fuel economy than the 45e ... a more modern charging rate also needed for the larger battery.

The 50e has a new system compared to the 45e, I don't know if it moved on to a higher voltage architecture, or it borrowed new developments from the iX. The iX is supposed to be the most energy efficient EV SUV according Edmunds

https://www.edmunds.com/car-news/202...ange-test.html

We looked at the iX and I really liked the interior(you don't see the exterior when you are inside right? ), but I can't get around the mileage limits when we do 4-5 road trips a year.

[headhunt3r]

Why not just rent the handful of times?

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by headhunt3r

Why not just rent the handful of times?

Why would I want to suffer through renting a car on a road trip? Every rental car I've had in the last decade has had some kind of issue or deficiency. On top of that I get a lesser car for the road trip. Anything that's large enough to be X5 class is going cost a pretty penny.

[AstulzerRZD]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

The 50e has a new system compared to the 45e, I don't know if it moved on to a higher voltage architecture, or it borrowed new developments from the iX.

is the faster charging rate on the 50e important to you? I found that with most chargepoint starions going by hour, 3.7kW on the 45e would make it non economical to charge

fuel economy gains wise, looks like it’s as simple as the more powerful motor helping during high load + the Atkinson cycle and other timing changes to the 3.0

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

is the faster charging rate on the 50e important to you? I found that with most chargepoint starions going by hour, 3.7kW on the 45e would make it non economical to charge

fuel economy gains wise, looks like it’s as simple as the more powerful motor helping during high load + the Atkinson cycle and other timing changes to the 3.0

I have zero interest in the higher charge rate as it's such a small battery, I don't really intend on paying for a charge station. Around town I would almost never drain the battery, and on a roadtrip I'll just pay for the gas.

I would love to pickup a 50e if sheerly for the dyno'ed power. Some ppl have put it on rollers and it puts out 500hp at the wheels. Alas, I do not have 120k for a 50e. A used 45e can be had around 70-80k right now, coupled with 5% GST only makes it a great deal for me.

[Badhobz]

just sell one of dem kids. MONEY GALORE

[yray]

anyone installed a charger recently, what did you end up getting

I swear all these chargers are made by the same company in dongguan.

[RabidRat]

Installed a ChargePoint Home Flex a couple yrs ago, hardwired for maximum 11.2 kW performance. No issues, like it a lot. Would do it again.

[dark0821]

All my clients has defaulted to Grizzle-E, so far no complaints from any of my clients~

They can get down to $399 on occasion but also rise to $599 as well, local Canadian company I believe. No affliation with them, just good results from word of mouth so far from my clients.

https://www.amazon.ca/Grizzl-Level-E...24&sr=8-6&th=1

[Koflach]

Originally Posted by yray

anyone installed a charger recently, what did you end up getting

I swear all these chargers are made by the same company in dongguan.

Just get a tesla charger and an adapter to j1772. Most all cars are moving over to NACS so you're just futureproofing your home charger this way.

[dark0821]

Yes = https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0C...0?ie=UTF8&th=1

Seems to work for all cars EXCEPT Wragler 4xE for some reason, some my clients got this for their Ioniq 5, coming from a previous Tesla ownership, so already had the Tesla charger at home.

Once again, not affliated hahaha, but just showing what worked for my clients.

[RabidRat]

There's a recently released version that has both plugs built in now.

It's like Magic Dock style where it'll give you either a J1772 or NACS, depending on what you need. It's pricier than the standard one but still less than a ChargePoint Home Flex. If you don't have anything against Tesla as a company then it seems like a good choice.

[AstulzerRZD]

Good news: EV road trip was fine, Electrify America seems to be working really reliably

Bad news: WTF on a EV6 at 75-85mph, this is more expensive to run than a 330i and almost M340i expensive

Really bad news: girlfriend was mad that chargers weren't near any nice restaurants or cute places. Finding a reasonable charger is really hard.

Trip: Cape Cod to NYC

For sake of comparison, 89/91 is $4.2ish per gallon.
IMO reasonable comparison for the power and comfort.

Charge 0: 100%, 305 miles stated range

Charge 1: 62.5kW via ChargePoint, $6.32 for 23kWh over 24 minutes at .28/kwh
124.5 miles, 3.5mi/kw, equivalent 82mpg or 2.9l/100km
City driving and cheap charging is where EVs really shine

Charge 2: 30kWh on 125kWh shared charger, Free for 2.5kWh
A 125kWh charger gives 80kWh to the first car to arrive and 30kWH to me?
Abandoned charge.

Charge 3: up to 235kW via Electrify America, $11.32 for 20kWh over 13 minutes at .56/kWh
125.1 mi, 3mi/kWh

Charge 4: 80-110kW via Revel, $26 for 46kWh over 30 minutes at .49/kWh
101mi, 2.9mi/kWh, equivalent 26mpg

330i RWD got 42mpg highway on Car and Driver 200mile 75mph test
330i xDrive got 36mpg
M340i AWD is rated for 33mpg
Overall cost: 35mpg or 6.7l/100km.
It's great that EVs are road trippable but they're defs more citi/suburb cars than road trippers

Avis should've just given me the Toyota Crown (42 mpg rated)/Prius (56 mpg rated) I asked for.

[Traum]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

Bad news: WTF on a EV6 at 75-85mph, this is more expensive to run than a 330i and almost M340i expensive

That's how it always is though -- once you go faster than ~100kph, efficiency starts taking a huge hit because air resistance goes up exponentially. ICE are affected by the same thing as well, although to a much smaller extent in the 100 - 120 range.

[AstulzerRZD]

I think is more the cost of fast charging that blew my mind.
60 cents per kw is a lot

[roastpuff]

That's very region dependent though. Here, BC Hydro fast chargers cost (in CAD) 35c/kwh, and Tesla Superchargers vary by location but around 20-40c/kwh.