Electric and Hybrid Car Thread

[AstulzerRZD]

They just wanna feel like they're a part of the decision making process and their need/want were heard

tbh car dealership should really do a thing where they have an active listener just let ur partner yap and serve them treats/dessert while they're at it

[roastpuff]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

how long are you out there for a track day?
could you just rent a 25/3500 from enterprise for a day or two?

enterprise gave us a F350 6.7 diesel for like $70 a day

That's definitely an option too...

An example trip would be to Oregon Raceway Park, I would not like to drive the S2000 down and would like to be able to carry supplies/spares etc.

I checked the local Enterprise truck rental, $400+tax for a 4-day rental, call it $200 for extra mileage (they give 200km per day, roughly 1500km for total trip given the running around to pick up trailer etc) and then another $450 + tax for U-Haul trailer rental. Plus gas etc... so that adds up to $1200 for the towing rental. That makes the track day far more expensive.

[AstulzerRZD]

Low key I would just rent a half ton and tow without telling them

It should come with hitch/trailer brake controller
& you'll have unlimited mileage

I don't think you need a 3/4 ton to tow s2k

[underscore]

UHaul trailers have surge brakes anyways, no brake controller needed.

Originally Posted by roastpuff

That's definitely an option too...

An example trip would be to Oregon Raceway Park, I would not like to drive the S2000 down and would like to be able to carry supplies/spares etc.

I checked the local Enterprise truck rental, $400+tax for a 4-day rental, call it $200 for extra mileage (they give 200km per day, roughly 1500km for total trip given the running around to pick up trailer etc) and then another $450 + tax for U-Haul trailer rental. Plus gas etc... so that adds up to $1200 for the towing rental. That makes the track day far more expensive.

Lazy searching and an X3 30e seems like $25-30k less than an equivalent Cayenne? So you're looking at 20+ track days to break even on the car itself. Plus the cost of the hitch install and extra depreciation/wear/maintenance from the added 3-5k km/yr at Porsche rates.

[68style]

roastpuff should just drive to all events in the S2k... I want to see him turn into jigglypuff

[AstulzerRZD]

I’ve driven s2k round trip Vancouver Seattle in a day before…..
Wasn’t fun but I did it lol

RE71R are pretty juggly

[68style]

Is yours slammed with race tires on it tho? hahaha

[AstulzerRZD]

Just RE71R

[roastpuff]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

Low key I would just rent a half ton and tow without telling them

It should come with hitch/trailer brake controller
& you'll have unlimited mileage

I don't think you need a 3/4 ton to tow s2k

1500 vs 2500 cost difference is $12 a day, and they don't list the 1500 as having tow hitch. Also still 200km mileage.

Originally Posted by underscore

UHaul trailers have surge brakes anyways, no brake controller needed.



Lazy searching and an X3 30e seems like $25-30k less than an equivalent Cayenne? So you're looking at 20+ track days to break even on the car itself. Plus the cost of the hitch install and extra depreciation/wear/maintenance from the added 3-5k km/yr at Porsche rates.

Part of the towing is to be able to go to further tracks without undue fatigue in the S2000 and bringing spare parts. 600km in a race-oriented S2000 sucks, plus you're relying on other guys for tools etc that you have to sacrifice for more important stuff. I would also love to bring a spare set of wheels/tires to the track as I've seen people bend wheels (not naming names) and have blowouts etc.

Originally Posted by 68style

roastpuff should just drive to all events in the S2k... I want to see him turn into jigglypuff

My spine would shatter and I would be more deaf than MG1. Gulolol?

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

I’ve driven s2k round trip Vancouver Seattle in a day before…..

Wasn’t fun but I did it lol

Yeah....

Granted the new suspension is much better, but I have to put in earplugs and put a pillow in the bucket seat.

[EvoFire]

Legitimately, what's your budget?

If she doesn't even drive 90% of the time, I'd put her opinions on read and get what works for you. The Cayenne is on average about 30% more than the X5 across most trim levels, go test drive both and decide if it's even worth it for you.

IMO the X5 is the better PHEV, but the Cayenne is probably the better gasser. The X5 is going to beat the Cayenne hands down in any utility comparison.

I've mentioned it here before, the X5 will move if you hustle it, but it's not a willing dancer. You can really feel the battery in the trunk and occasionally the whacked up weight distribution can really be felt. For a very good description, the car will try to 911 you if you aren't careful with it. It's actually a well known problem in Europe as PHEV with a battery in the trunk well is a very common setup over there, road tests have shown their PHEV wagons swapping ends on emergency evasive manuever tests.

If there's no kids in the plans for you guys, she's gonna stay not driving.

[dark0821]

since everyone is throwing stuff at it and see what sticks....


a domestic made korean brand is what she wants....




ON a side note... Federal IZEV is also leaving... so for EVs... its now or never tbh...notification came in @ 3:24pm today Jan 10th

[noclue]

You're looking at enterprise truck rental which have mileage limitations, the passenger side and its competitors like alamo offer half-tons with unlimited mileage. All half tons have a tow hitch from factory.

Even the full-size SUV ones like tahoe/expedition will work

[AstulzerRZD]

Originally Posted by roastpuff

1500 vs 2500 cost difference is $12 a day, and they don't list the 1500 as having tow hitch. Also still 200km mileage.

The normal rental agencies will have the 1500 with unlimited mileage

They say towing unavailable because they don’t necessarily want you to tow with them

But every single full size pickup has a 2 inch receiver and 4/7 pin connectors standard

[underscore]

Originally Posted by roastpuff

Part of the towing is to be able to go to further tracks without undue fatigue in the S2000 and bringing spare parts. 600km in a race-oriented S2000 sucks, plus you're relying on other guys for tools etc that you have to sacrifice for more important stuff. I would also love to bring a spare set of wheels/tires to the track as I've seen people bend wheels (not naming names) and have blowouts etc.

That sounds like more reason to rent something because you'll need to factor in payload capacity and stuff like that adds up fast. You're losing probably 500lbs right off the bat from the tongue weight, as well as whatever the passengers weigh.

[AstulzerRZD]

Originally Posted by noclue

You're looking at enterprise truck rental which have mileage limitations, the passenger side and its competitors like alamo offer half-tons with unlimited mileage. All half tons have a tow hitch from factory.

Even the full-size SUV ones like tahoe/expedition will work

The Tahoe/Expedition spec in fleets usually have the hands free self drive equipped too.

Supercruise will work hands free even with a trailer attached.

[roastpuff]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

Legitimately, what's your budget?

If she doesn't even drive 90% of the time, I'd put her opinions on read and get what works for you. The Cayenne is on average about 30% more than the X5 across most trim levels, go test drive both and decide if it's even worth it for you.

IMO the X5 is the better PHEV, but the Cayenne is probably the better gasser. The X5 is going to beat the Cayenne hands down in any utility comparison.

I've mentioned it here before, the X5 will move if you hustle it, but it's not a willing dancer. You can really feel the battery in the trunk and occasionally the whacked up weight distribution can really be felt. For a very good description, the car will try to 911 you if you aren't careful with it. It's actually a well known problem in Europe as PHEV with a battery in the trunk well is a very common setup over there, road tests have shown their PHEV wagons swapping ends on emergency evasive manuever tests.

If there's no kids in the plans for you guys, she's gonna stay not driving.

Let's cap it around 60k? Honestly I might try to convince her with a gas Cayenne or X5, that kind of opens up a lot more options. Good to know about the X5. We want kids, and I have pointed out that she needs to drive more, but she keeps saying "next time." Old argument that I don't care to bring up right now.

Originally Posted by underscore

That sounds like more reason to rent something because you'll need to factor in payload capacity and stuff like that adds up fast. You're losing probably 500lbs right off the bat from the tongue weight, as well as whatever the passengers weigh.

Yeah, but at $1500+ a pop that's a hard pill to swallow. I'm going to have to figure out if I can get rentals of full size SUV or trucks for cheap like what RZD mentioned.

EDIT: I have driven the Cayenne, but not a recent X5. Cayenne has that Porsche magic to it, which is nuts in a SUV.

[roastpuff]

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

The Tahoe/Expedition spec in fleets usually have the hands free self drive equipped too.

Supercruise will work hands free even with a trailer attached.

Quick check of Enterprise shows a full size SUV rental for $472 for the same 4 days, unlimited KM. The half ton rental only had 600km included.

Interestingly using Costco car rental finder, the pickup truck at $250 had unlimited mileage.

[BIC_BAWS]

Originally Posted by roastpuff

Open trailer with S2000 is what I want to tow. Need about 5500-6000lbs capacity on the safe side. Cayenne listed at 7700lbs.

Wife wants: SUV, hybrid - no trucks allowed, no domestics allowed, "not too big" whatever that means.

I want: towing, decent driving experience. It basically came down to the Cayenne hybrid or the X5 hybrid, and she thinks the X5 size is too large

Originally Posted by AstulzerRZD

-------------

Math:

Gas: 15L/100km, 25c/km

3kw charging Cayenne: 37c/km because $2/hr, max out at 3kw, 66c/kw, 1kw = 1.6km or so.
5 hour topup for 30km.

7kw charging Cayenne: 18c/km because $2/hr, you get 6kw at most station, 33c/kw
3 hour topup for 30km.

60kw DCFC Mercedes: 16-20c/km with 35c/kw at BCHydro, 27c/kw at Tesla
30 minute topup for 80km.

Originally Posted by roastpuff

You are 100% correct, she heard that PHEV can drive "Free" but doesn't understand the detail and math

I have a wild idea.. that is definitely not environmentally friendly.. but the value prop is in the savings

2025 Cayenne E-Hybrid ranges from 150K -160K per AutoTrader. A 2021/2020 goes for around 60-70K.

An X5 35d goes for around $30K. According to fuelly, it ~ 9L/100km. Diesel and premium gas (91) prices are more or less the same (within a 10c var). Without doing the math, you'd save on the actual purchase cost of the vehicle (~30-40K) and per tank cost (~8L/100km).

@AstulzerRZD can you pls do the math?

Edit: I'm finding it hard to find the electric/hybrid cost savings.

I did my own math. $4113 for 24, 713 km = $0.16/km ... on my CTR.

[roastpuff]

Diesel comes with its own pile of problems - the first thing you'd want to do is delete the emissions equipment and do a tune. Also they do not like short trips as they take a long time to warm up. My commute is 15km one way.

Not to mention the uphill fight I'm going to have with her regarding diesel "pollution" and "not hybrid", as well as the difference in interior from a 2018 X5 (I think that's the latest diesel) to a G05 one.

EDIT: Oh forgot, her assertion that X5 is "too large"

[bcrdukes]

Ewww Porsche. Gross.

[JDMDreams]

Used model y x for < $50000, not sure how much they can tow though.

What if you rent one of those enclosed box trucks, can you drive your s2000 on with ramps

[roastpuff]

Originally Posted by JDMDreams

Used model y x for < $50000, not sure how much they can tow though.

What if you rent one of those enclosed box trucks, can you drive your s2000 on with ramps

3500lbs, and oh god trying to charge with 110v using a 50ft extension cord lmao.

[Badhobz]

Here's an insane idea!!!

get rid of the s2k, and the A4, and then get a Porsche GT4 and you can do everything without requiring a "delivery" truck.

[bcrdukes]

How is he going to carry his race wheels, gas cans, tools, and accessories?

[Badhobz]

oh da roooof Dakar style of course (or you can tow a small trailer cant you?)