OBD1 B16A or B18C1 swaps

[hoofenshnoz]

Hey ya'll

I managed to pick up a gem of an EG coupe, bone stock 1995 civic si from the original owner with 92,000 original KMs!

I've been toying with the idea of swapping in an engine but all the online JDM swap sites are asking around 3000.00-4000.00 CAD which was more than the car. On the flip side all the swaps on CL are very high KM.

I'm old now and don't want to do anything crazy (my last turbo b18c1 civic was too much for a DD) but a little more power would be nice. Am I really going to have to dump 3-4K on a swap for a 20 year old car?

Thanks!

[tegra7]

Keep it stock and wait a few years then apply for collector plates.

[threezero]

it seems like you brought a perfect condition eg for under 3G. Congrats! These cars are at the bottom of depreciation, even decent condition eg could go for the same amount that you pick up yours for.

Now here comes the other part. ANYTHING you do to the car will be more than it's worth. Any kind of mechanical work if not done by yourself gonna seems pricey in comparison to the value of the car Itself. It's looks like you will need a clutch job in the new future and a timing belt. That's easy 1-2g right now. Suspension refresh and upgrade could ran you another grand. That just doing maintance things.

3G for a swap is that just part or also labour? Also consider that the in 99% of the case whatever money you put into modifying it you will never get back.

I brought my ef with complete working swap done for less than a "swap kit", previous owner/s has done a lot of work on it my guess it they did not get their money back as well.

Modify it for your enjoyment, don't focus too much on the money part. And don't forget it's an old car, thing will begin to break left and right if it hasn't alreAdy so be prepare for that.
Also keep in mind, to most other none car people you are driving a 20 year old civic. Any money you spent on it will be seen as a waste.

And show us some pictures

[extracrunchie]

is it cheaper to throw a k series in there?

[thumper]

not sure what you paid for yours, but i would keep it stock. at this vintage and condition, unless you can do the work yourself or you got everything at a good price, you would be just losing money. go buy another that already has the swap done and let someone else eat the cost and headaches

[hoofenshnoz]

Wow thanks for the all advice peep!
I've already modified 4 civics over the years (I'm 29 now). I just really love driving these cars, they were a great design IMO. But as a DD I feel the D16Z6 is too underpowered and no, I don't feel like turbo charging it, that's an old headache.

I've never seen a civic so stock before (even had the old honda tape deck in it still), nothing has been tampered which is why I thought a drop in OBD1 DOHC engine would suit it well. The prices I mentioned above is just the hardware, I would be doing the swap with my cousin who is a licensed mechanic.

Perhaps you guys are right though, spending that kinda dough on an old car just might not be worth the trouble.

[jaretron]

I'm a little out of practice with Honda swap pricing but I'm pretty sure a z6 swap with that many kms you could probably sell for $1000.

My point being that it would help with the cost of a new swap.

[hoofenshnoz]

That's a good point!

[Timpo]

Did you do a research? Why B16/B18?

Apparently K20/K24 is a lot more durable, a lot more powerful, and a lot lighter.
More aftermarket support, everything.

It's very easy to swap because it's been done thousands of times and so many kits are available.

The difference between B series and K series is night and day.

[jaretron]

Originally Posted by Timpo

The difference between B series and K series is night and day.

So is the cost last time I checked.

I know 2-3 years ago a k-swap was $10g, yes I know you can get an K engine for a fraction of that but that's not where the cost is, ecu, mounts, header, shift linkage, etc. I think you would be hard pressed to find a shop that would do a k swap for any less than twice the price of a B swap.

[hoofenshnoz]

Yah the only reason why I was thinking going OBD1 B16A or B18C1 swap is the simplicity, it's almost a direct bolt-in.

[jaretron]

Have you considered supercharging the z6?

[Lowered_Klass]

The bottom line is, you should be doing this because you want to. If you're not comfortable spending that kind of money on it, then like others have said, keep it stock, and just replace things as needed.

But, seeing as you've had modded Hondas before, the chances of you keeping this stock is slim to none lol.

If it were me, I would look into a B20. Not a B20vtec hybrid, just a stock B20 from a CRV. These motors can still be found fairly cheap, lower kms, and for the most part, not beaten to piss like a ligher km B16/B18 Vtec motor. My arguement being, if this is just a daily, where you want more grunt for around town, this might be your best bet. Not to mention you can still do a header/intake etc etc to help give it a lil extra.

A K swap would be awesome, but no matter what anyone tells you, they're still a very expensive swap. Yes they've become common place, and are fairly easy, but parts for the whole swap add up quickly. Do a little poking around on some of the Honda forums and you'll see what I mean.

[TysonK]

^^same as what I would recommend. Stock B20, if you want add cams and a header later. The B20 in my car with Crower 403's is putting down 178whp and 150tq.

[hoofenshnoz]

I'm totally just looking for a little more grunt without breaking the bank, tuning can be a slippery slope into homelessness if you're not careful so I plan on just keeping things simple with a nicer engine.

I thought these civics couldn't handle the weight of a B20 up front without stiffening the suspension, am I wrong?

The stock B20 only has 126HP though does it not? It will obv have a ton more torque but I do mostly highway driving. Being able to pass vehicles quicker would be ideal.

[jaretron]

Originally Posted by hoofenshnoz

I thought these civics couldn't handle the weight of a B20 up front without stiffening the suspension, am I wrong?

Pretty sure all b-series engines are the same weight. It's the H-series that weigh more.

[TysonK]

Originally Posted by hoofenshnoz

I thought these civics couldn't handle the weight of a B20 up front without stiffening the suspension, am I wrong?

The stock B20 only has 126HP though does it not? It will obv have a ton more torque but I do mostly highway driving. Being able to pass vehicles quicker would be ideal.

Eh... it's marginally heavier. And my stock B20 with an LS intake manifold, stock exhaust made 143whp (dyno'd). These motors are somewhat underated.

You want to keep the stock suspension? I'd probably look at a set of koni's with springs at least.

[fliptuner]

I have a complete, OBD1 B16A3 that threw a timing belt, that I might be willing to sell. All wiring, accessories, in/ex, dist., alt., wiring, ecu, etc...

Obviously, the head would have to come off to assess what needs work. I'd be willing to remove it, so we could inspect the pistons, for someone that's serious.

@TysonK, what ECU/tune are you running?

[hoofenshnoz]

143 HP is much better than 126. They're going for less than a grand too on JDM sites...Now you have me thinking.

FlipTuner thanks for the thought but as I have limited free time I'm hoping I can just do a direct swap with something already good-to-go.

What OBD is the B20? I don't know a lot about these engines and google hasn't given me a clear answer.

[fliptuner]

Np. B20 = OBD2, hence using the LS intake

[SumAznGuy]

IIRC, the earlier B20B's were slightly lower compression while the later model B20Z is the one with the higher HP due to higher compression.
Stock B20Z intake manifolds also don't fit under the Civic's hood which is another reason for the LS intake manifold.

[fliptuner]

Sorry, yes, the B20 intake is huge lol

[hoofenshnoz]

Thanks everyone! I'm gonna look into this further.

[fliptuner]

Simply put, it's just an LS swap, using a B20 long block.

[vitaminG]

theres a couple cheap b16s on craigs from wreckers

2000 Honda Civic DX hatchback B16A2 ENGINE FOR SALE!!

1999 HONDA CIVIC Si-R B16A2 Engine + Transmission for sale 180 000KM!!

some cheap h22s on there too