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HELP! with Candy paint. My painters had warned me about this, now it's clear you can see the dark blotches/clouding underneath the paint in the attached first video of my trunk. It looks horrible! on other panels it's not as obvious since there are curves and corners and it just looks like the color is shifting. But I can't accept how it looks on large flat panels like the trunk.
Any experienced painters could provide advice? The painters on my car is pretty pro already , but here in HK it's not common to find Candy tricoat paint experience.
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Its hard to say what it is without watching him spray it. Could be many things.
He could have been laying it too heavy in some areas to try and flow it out.
Could be uneven application.
And also, you shouldnt spray a candy color with the panels off the car. Each panel will look different. Usually candy jobs are sprayed with all the panels bolted on so it looks even. It's hard to get perfect.
Can't be that much of a pro if that's the result. LOL. All jokes aside, majority of the time blotchiness/cloudy comes from improper overlap or improper needle tip. Like Suprarz666 it can also be a number of things which can be the following...
gun setup (improper fan pattern)
too much material/ not enough material going through gun
too close/ too far
too fast/ too slow
improper reduction ratio (DIN4 cup test?)
improper reducer selected (assuming its not water-based)
mid coat/candy coat was mixed improper
insufficient flash time
gun selection (maybe his paint gun can't handle mid coats?)
And yes it's also not advised to paint parts off the car for candy coats but if it is done then EVERY pass and EVERY coat down to clearcoat has to be applied EXACTLY the same way for EVERY panel.
Lastly what's the color code you used? Is the midcoat basecoat version or is it clearcoat version? If there's a clearcoat version I'd recommend that instead. The application is MUCH easier.
I've talked with the body shop which is actually a supercar shop, however most supercar are still not 3coat paints (Kandy). The paints and equipment they use are supposingly top tier, and they follow all the protocols recommended to them. Reason they paint it with the panels off is because they took my car apart and I assume is to cover all the panels fully(front and back) instead of just spraying over it. I'm actually okay with how most of the car came out as in the other videos of the shell and hood/bumper, i cant really tell if there is uneveness or not as per my other videos on my first post, but it's on the large flat surfaces like my trunk panel in the first vid, you can see the dark clouding.
So in short, they are telling me that all the questions 6thgear mentioned are already correct and followed. But they are telling me that no matter what, this clouding will happen because of this 3stage paint I chose. They tell me they're "willing" to make things right, even paint it again, but then it will have clouding no matter what, it's just more apparent on large flat surfaces . Can anyone confirm this claim?
This is their paint area, so i assume the painters should really know what they're doing
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Last edited by prelude_prince; 11-15-2017 at 03:19 AM.
Lastly what's the color code you used? Is the midcoat basecoat version or is it clearcoat version? If there's a clearcoat version I'd recommend that instead. The application is MUCH easier.
It's the color from the 2016 NSX, Valencia Red Pearl, R556P. Sikkens paints
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Last edited by prelude_prince; 11-30-2017 at 05:42 PM.
Reason: Edited for correct paint brand
Well, if they are doing everything absolutely perfect like they say, maybe they should call in a paint rep for assistance.
I haven't personally sprayed that color, But i've sprayed Mazda Soul Red many times and it is a similar 3 stage paint. I haven't had blotching issues on large flat panels before with that color.
Why didn't you listen when they told you this would happen?
Best suggestion as stated above is to have their paint rep for that product come in and see what their explanation is, or repaint it with a different product.
Good luck, make sure to follow up with updated pics.
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Why didn't you listen when they told you this would happen?
Best suggestion as stated above is to have their paint rep for that product come in and see what their explanation is, or repaint it with a different product.
Good luck, make sure to follow up with updated pics.
Well they did tell me they could do any color as long as I could find a color code for it. Not until everything was apart and work started they shot up test panels that this problem was brought up. I brought my car to this shop for this reason, I figured if they can't do it, no one else in HK can. And noted, I will ask them to request a paint rep for my next visitr
This was my fender they test sprayed on and the clouding was not apparent.
From left to right the 3 colors are the new NSX Valencia Red (3coat) (the one I chose now), Competizione Rosso (3coat) (Alfa 4C), and Rosso Efresto (2coat) (Rare Lambo Color)
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Last edited by prelude_prince; 11-15-2017 at 03:05 PM.
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Do you have anymore high resolution pictures instead of videos?
Videos and updates are sent to me from my mechanic as the bodyshop is quite far away.
These two pictures are the only ones I took when I visited the shop after they painted the shell, again, the clouding wasn't apparent here or in person
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Seems you’re adamant the shop knows what they’re doing, so then how does Honda/Acura paint the 2017 NSX that colour without issue from the factory?
The painter isn’t doing it right. Simple answer.
This is correct, and I asked them the same question. Their answer was that the process is different, factory automation and baked/cooked/electro coated? paint (don't know the correct term), versus hand sprayed.
So you are again right in the sense that the painter can't do it right 100% as per factory, and I agree with that, but I just didn't expect that level of clouding. I suppose now is to wait for the official reply from one of the reps, to see if the clouding in this specific paint can be 100% avoided by human manual process.
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
same. I've had an experience where we received a car back from the bodyshop, and it was poorly done, wasn't blended. Painter said that it was difficult to paint metallic/pearlescent colours. Ok, fine.
Few years later, we were at another shop (different car), and just to make sure, we asked the owner make sure it's a job well done, and he said "No, there's no difference in painting solid colours and metallic". And they did do a pretty good job.
So in my experience, if they're making excuses and such, saying "oh this is the best it's gonna get", the person doing the job isn't good enough to tackle that job
So I checked your paint code based off of the paint line I use and it actually calls for tinted clearcoat instead of the traditional basecoat midcoat. Basically it's the candy dye that gets mixed with clearcoat which then is applied over the ground basecoat then finally a normal layer of clearcoat is then applied. I find this application to be much more user friendly than the traditional Tri-coat/Candy. You need to find out from the painter if there is other solutions like this. This is much like Ford RR which is a tinted candy/mid and after a couple tries I hadn't had much issues *knock on wood*
Now the process at the factory isn't that much different other than the equipment is much bigger and it covers the panels much better and add to the fact its programmed robotic arms VS human arms. Baked/electro-coat doesn't make a difference so don't buy into that BS the shop is telling you. This may merely be an example of inexperience for candy color. But to be honest candy paint jobs has always been a big PITA but it's a lot easier application these days compared to the old days.
So I checked your paint code based off of the paint line I use and it actually calls for tinted clearcoat instead of the traditional basecoat midcoat. Basically it's the candy dye that gets mixed with clearcoat which then is applied over the ground basecoat then finally a normal layer of clearcoat is then applied. I find this application to be much more user friendly than the traditional Tri-coat/Candy. You need to find out from the painter if there is other solutions like this. This is much like Ford RR which is a tinted candy/mid and after a couple tries I hadn't had much issues *knock on wood*
Now the process at the factory isn't that much different other than the equipment is much bigger and it covers the panels much better and add to the fact its programmed robotic arms VS human arms. Baked/electro-coat doesn't make a difference so don't buy into that BS the shop is telling you. This may merely be an example of inexperience for candy color. But to be honest candy paint jobs has always been a big PITA but it's a lot easier application these days compared to the old days.
Gotcha, thanks everyone for their comments and advice! It's hard to argue with a painter who comes with years of experience and pride especially if you're not in the field. But I get the points everyone is mentioning so I'll have a talk with them and arrange visit with the rep, and will report back.
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Update: I finally had a chance to look at the car in person and honestly I can't see the defects outside of the booth. The 3stage color does look delicious and shifts a lot depending on the angle you look at it and such. I'm still waiting to have a talk with the paint rep though.
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Last edited by prelude_prince; 11-20-2017 at 03:09 AM.
Side question - have you contacted Honda to see if they would repaint it for you at the factory?
I didn't consider that due to the price and logistics involved. They have/had NSX refresh programs in the NSX factory, prices were pretty insane if I remember. Doubt they would do non-factory colors too, and i'm a aftermarket > oem guy.
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Quote:
Originally posted by fuzebox Once upon a time there was a carbon fibre hood named "Ricey", and all his life he wished he was painted to match the rest of the car he belonged too. One day...
Color looks/reacts different under different light sources. How it looks in the paint booth will look different from incandescent light to outdoor natural light. Even outside in the shade or direct sunlight will look different. You should roll the car outside on a clear sunny day and see if the blotchness/clouding is still visible. Usually with clouding in my experience you will see it most on cloudy/overcast days. If the blotchiness is severe enough you will see it under any light source.
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