REVscene - Vancouver Automotive Forum

underscore · 03-20-2018, 09:40 PM

Since I haven't been getting much interest through the usual methods I'm considering listing my car there, but since it's $99 to list a vehicle with them I'm wondering if anyone has an experience with them (either on the buying or selling side).

The Producer · 03-20-2018, 10:01 PM

heard about a local PNW'r having a dead beat buyer recently. BAT is not a contract - you have not sold the car to the winning bidder until they pay. (neither is eBay motors). BAT also dictates your reserve price - they don't like auctions that don't finish.

having said that - 99 bucks is nothing compared to the exposure your vehicle will get.

what usual methods are you talking about? is yours the 25k car on CL?

SkunkWorks · 03-20-2018, 10:45 PM

$25k??

While I think BAT is generally a great venue for exposure, I personally don't think you'll get anywhere close to that on there. And you won't like their reserve either.

As The Producer has mentioned, has been a few cases lately of non-committing buyers after the fact. There's a white E30 M3 that sold for $58k USD on there and is now back up locally for $75k CAD. Ouch.

tegra7 · 03-20-2018, 11:43 PM

BAT is picky when accepting vehicles to be posted for sale on their site. I remember when a member here was wanting to list his low mileage EM1 on BAT, but was declined due to modifications. Would help if you mention what vehicle you are wanting to sell.

BIC_BAWS · 03-20-2018, 11:52 PM

Probably this one, if I had to guess, I'd guess RSer

https://vancouver.craigslist.ca/van/...531250351.html

68style · 03-21-2018, 08:45 AM

One time I had a co-worker that had a low mileage classic Saab she'd owned since new that she wanted to sell... so I wrote her Craigslist ad and took all the photos for her, then I just "anonymously" submitted the Craigslist ad as a lead to BaT and boom the next day it was on their site and we sold it within a week to a guy in the USA... no auction fees, no nothing... I just knew they're suckers for old Saab's on there and there's no way they would be able to know it was my own ad when I submitted it... lol!

Ironically I ended up working for them for awhile, now it's primarily an auction site... not that much fun anymore. But you could try what I did and see what happens! Just as much exposure, but no auction fees.

I don't buy the EM1 story above, BaT has tonnes of highly modified cars on its site... must have been something wrong with it.

That said, if it's your car in the link above, I hate to say it but that price is very unrealistic... that's a stretch for even a mint low mileage LHD 1994/95 MR2 Turbo or even mint stock low mileage FD RX-7 territory.

Here is something comparable that did sell on BaT (although apparently the buyer flaked from comments) and also had the advantage of being LHD:
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...sainz-edition/

TouringTeg · 03-21-2018, 11:51 AM

First let me say I am a big BaT fan and have followed a lot of auctions. Especially 90s JDM / Pcars and auctions of Canadian cars. I have learned a few things.

First of all I have to agree with 68style in that $25k is pretty high. GT4's are a cool cars but do not have a big following and so they don't get a bump up from nostalgia. BaT generally has low to reasonable reserves because they only collect the buyers fee if the car sells.

1. Stock or near stock cars do much better than modified cars. It is much easier to buy a car long distance that is all stock. The more modified the more questions come up. Keep in mind auctions are just one week which doesn't leave a lot of time for a PPI or to get eyes on it. Many cars are bought sight unseen if the car is presented well with plenty of quality pictures and videos, maintenance records, history report and an involved seller.

2. Canadian cars always struggle. The majority of BaT users are American and many are unfamiliar with how to import from Canada because they have so much choice int he USA. It also costs time and money so American buyers want to buy below market to make up for the extra cost. I do the same thing if I plan to buy a car in the US. It has to be a good deal or a rare car.

The EM1 being discussed was mine. 1999 Honda Civic SiR black with 61,546 kms (38,245 miles). Pretty modified but mainly reversible mods. I submitted it about 18 months ago and they turned it down. At the time they had not accepted many golden era Hondas (aside from NSX, S2000, Type R). Shortly after they started accepting more EM1, GSR, etc. They suddenly changed their tune so I think that is why they turned mine down.

I wish I could have kept it and taken it more back to stock. I scored some mint EM1 OEM wheels and sold it to a Vancouver buyer so it is around.

https://www.usedvictoria.com/classif...dents_27629007

This Vancouver 1990 Nissan Skyline GTR was "sold" Aug 2017 on BaT and again the buyer flaked. It was on craiglist a week later and I spoke to the seller about it. It seems a lot of US buyers flake on Canadian cars because they decide to they don't want to spend the time and money. A side note I sold my EM1 on Ebay to a WA state buyer and suddenly they demanded to pay PayPal for the entire purchase. I was very clear in my auction that is deposit by PP and the balance by wire transfer. They refused to wire transfer and didn't want to come to Victoria so the sale fell apart.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...kyline-gt-r-5/

underscore · 03-21-2018, 11:54 AM

Yeah the $25k one on CL is mine, I'm having a hard time sorting out how to make it less wordy while still explaining what the car is and how extensive the work done to it is. The only people I'd expect to have any interest in the car are people who specifically want an RC. As a Celica GTFour it's expensive, but since it's a real RC and considering the overhaul it's had I don't think I'm *too* far off for an asking price. I think that Italian one with no history resold for $9,700 USD ($12.5k CAD), and a year ago another JDM one in similar condition to it sold through an importer for $15k USD ($19.4k CAD).

With a bunch of stuff swapped back to stock (ie rims, coilovers, bbk, driveshaft, gauges, etc) I'd take something in the low 20's. I wouldn't be happy about it, but I'd take it. I've got it insured til mid-June at the moment, if I don't get any serious interest for it complete before then I think I'll put it as close to stock as possible and go from there.

Right now I have it posted on a whack of FB groups, Kijiji and on CL in Vancouver, Seattle, San Fran, Pheonix, Vegas, and Dallas. Nothing but idiots and scams so far.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Producer

BAT also dictates your reserve price - they don't like auctions that don't finish.

That's most likely gonna be a deal-breaker for me.

TouringTeg · 03-21-2018, 12:15 PM

Definitely be patient as it is a special car. RHD cars are always a tougher sell in North America for obvious reasons. Took me a while to sell my Supra TT auto RHD. Sold for 21k to a Toronto buyer. Auto didn't help of course but many people just won't touch RHD so your pool of buyers is small.

Don't forget autotrader.ca is free as well. Wouldn't hurt to also do usedvictoria.com Plenty of Vancouver dealers list over here for more exposure. The more parts you can take off to lower the price the better. People love a low purchase price rather than getting extras.

I wish you luck with the scammers and low ballers. Selling a car online is painful.

Two of my friends had LHD GTfour's back in the day. A red one and a green one. Probably the only two in Victoria.

The Producer · 03-21-2018, 02:44 PM

you didn't post here for us to bust your balls, so please don't take offense to the following

You should rework your ad. It's detailed which is good, but it rambles on. Lines about the listing of mods from memory etc. are unnecessary. Saying the car isn't perfect isn't necessary. Personally I don't even like wiki dumps about cars in ads. I'm not looking for car knowledge in ads - I'm looking for details about your specific example.

I'd be inclined to tighten up the ad and pour that detailed info into a pdf you can send to interested parties.

You need way more pics. Look at how many pics are in a BAT post. People aren't buying cars long distance without very detailed pictures of every aspect of the car. If you know somebody that can help you do a shoot of your car it does wonders. BTW - it should be super clean/detailed before taking pics.

Shoot and upload a vid of it running. This is a big one if your going to try to sell long distance.

I'd consider pulling some of the aftermarket stuff to go after a collector.

Finally I don't think you're quite ready to sell yet. Some of the stuff you mentioned in your "issues" list could easily be taken care of before posting a car like this. I'd at least fix the door, power seat and most importantly take care of the rust.

Don't get me wrong - the car is dope af, but it won't get anywhere near BAT without at least taking care of the above, so why not do it for everywhere else you could post it too.

Note: I haven't talked about price because I don't know your specific market. Nothing I've mentioned above has anything to do with your specific car or asking price - it's what anybody should do that wants to sell a specialty vehicle, with a limited market.

I wish you the best of luck on your sale. The car is dope. I remember the NA version of the all-trac. I really wanted one in high-school. If I hadn't had VW friends I could easily have ended up down a different car path.

BTW I'll pull this post if you don't want to see it here.

(PS - submitting the CL lead to BAT is a great idea - too bad they're so focused on auctions I barely see any finds anymore)

underscore · 03-21-2018, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Producer

You should rework your ad. It's detailed which is good, but it rambles on. Lines about the listing of mods from memory etc. are unnecessary. Saying the car isn't perfect isn't necessary. Personally I don't even like wiki dumps about cars in ads. I'm not looking for car knowledge in ads - I'm looking for details about your specific example.

Good point. Especially with a niche car, unless someone already knows what it is before opening the ad I'm guessing they aren't likely to buy it. I tried to shorten it up a bit, I'm thinking it might almost be better to just have bullet points so it's:

Spoiler!

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Producer

I'd be inclined to tighten up the ad and pour that detailed info into a pdf you can send to interested parties.

Also a good idea. I've got the link to alltrac.net in there but I was thinking of making a google-doc or something else that's publicly viewable and putting more detailed info on the history/work in it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Producer

You need way more pics. Look at how many pics are in a BAT post. People aren't buying cars long distance without very detailed pictures of every aspect of the car. If you know somebody that can help you do a shoot of your car it does wonders. BTW - it should be super clean/detailed before taking pics.

Shoot and upload a vid of it running. This is a big one if your going to try to sell long distance.

Finally I don't think you're quite ready to sell yet. Some of the stuff you mentioned in your "issues" list could easily be taken care of before posting a car like this. I'd at least fix the door, power seat and most importantly take care of the rust.

These mainly fall into it being the tail end of winter here, and how little I've used the car since I bought it. Those are the only half decent pictures of it that I have. Now that it's warmer I'll clean up as many of the issues as I can and get some proper photos.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Producer

I'd consider pulling some of the aftermarket stuff to go after a collector.

Similar to above, I need to find the time to pull off as much stuff as I can. Which is a bit of a fail on my part because most of it just got put on, but I digress.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Producer

Don't get me wrong - the car is dope af, but it won't get anywhere near BAT without at least taking care of the above, so why not do it for everywhere else you could post it too.

Note: I haven't talked about price because I don't know your specific market. Nothing I've mentioned above has anything to do with your specific car or asking price - it's what anybody should do that wants to sell a specialty vehicle, with a limited market.

I wish you the best of luck on your sale. The car is dope. I remember the NA version of the all-trac. I really wanted one in high-school. If I hadn't had VW friends I could easily have ended up down a different car path.

BTW I'll pull this post if you don't want to see it here.

(PS - submitting the CL lead to BAT is a great idea - too bad they're so focused on auctions I barely see any finds anymore)

Thanks, and thanks for the input. Any and all input on how to better advertise the car is appreciated, it's tricky because I know people like info but then I'll see some absolutely shit ads get a car sold almost instantly. Boggles the mind.

twitchyzero · 03-21-2018, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by underscore

I think that Italian one with no history resold for $9,700 USD ($12.5k CAD), and a year ago another JDM one in similar condition to it sold through an importer for $15k USD ($19.4k CAD).

25k = 20k usd? and they have to fly up and pay import fees & taxes

I don't know what the rhd Toyota market is like, but if it's anything like the limited run of Subaru STi this and that or a Honda type-R...I don't believe many got over what they imported for, probably lucky to even break even...only exception seems to be a RX7, Supra, or GT-R (S15 soon?)

agree with the other guy, you don't seem ready to sell

TouringTeg · 03-22-2018, 08:20 AM

Yes the R32 GTR and 93+ Supra's have been appreciating. S15 as well. I know a local seller sold his S15 NA manual for a profit to a WA buyer even though it wasn't even legal for import yet. 96+ ITR will likely appreciate too as they get closer to 25 yrs old since LHD cars are up in price and inventory is low. Sounds like NSX prices are also climbing.

Speaking of EM1 and BaT

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2000-honda-civic-11/

TouringTeg · 03-22-2018, 03:08 PM

Unfortunately even the buyers fee is not enough to stop flakes.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1999-honda-civic-6/
In this case BaT refused to remove the "Sold" text at the top even though the "seller" requested it be removed.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1997-toyota-supra-5/
In this case the seller backed out and BaT admitted it. Probably didn't like the sale price.

underscore · 03-22-2018, 04:42 PM

I skimmed the thread a commenter linked about that Supra, looks like it had a $3k buyers fee on top of the $58k for the car. I think that works out to about 5%, to me that's seems a bit steep for what they do.

donk. · 03-22-2018, 04:46 PM

another owner thinking his car is the shit because he modified it.
car is only worth how much a buyer is willing to pay.

twitchyzero · 03-22-2018, 09:15 PM

I remember a regular here trying to sell his heavily modified 2000 S2000 10 yrs back for $40K and got flamed pretty hard, three different ads later he must've ended up selling less than 25K

https://www.revscene.net/forums/5853...-widebody.html

VR6GTI · 03-23-2018, 08:42 AM

^ Hopefully someone paid him to put those flares yeesh.