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I've tried a MY16 GT but don't see too many on the road, owners what do you like, what don't you like? when does a new model year usually come out?
RF specific questions: what tires does it come with? Are the stock brakes adequate or the brembos worth it?
the price, the infotainment and trunk space is certainly noticed. it'll be a daily...the odd autox/track.. a weekend trip for two seems like it'll be bursting at its seams.
When the ND first came out, I went for a Mazda autox-style test drive, and I was HOOKED right on the first try. Bear in mind I'm saying this as a current NC owner, and have driven plenty of NA and NB aggressive on and off the track.
The thing that I liked most about a stock ND is how light and agile it is. IMO, the best trait a sports car can have is a lack of weight, and the ND scores major, major points there because there is absolutely nothing else that can reproduce the same experience. (The Elise / Exige is a whole different price level, and lacks the comfort, practicality, and even just ease of getting in and out of the car compared to the ND. And then it is nowhere nearly as reliable as an ND as well.) Dynamically, the car is neutral and telepathic. I literally just have to think of doing something, and then the car just does it. Even in the ND1 stock form, the engine is very, very torquey, and that makes for a very responsive drive.
The things that do not work for me are:
- the tight cabin
- a good seating position with enough head room
- the stock ND1's engine runs out of breath at the top end
- the stock suspension is too soft, and you really need to wait for it to settle
The small cabin really fits like a glove. For me, that is really both a blessing and a curse. When I am only focusing on driving, it is fantastic because everything that I need is there within easy reach, and everything is at the right place! When I try to factor everyday living with that, I know there are going to be challenges. I'm sure it'll be doable, but it isn't naturally meant to do that.
The seating position / headroom issue is because of my physique. I have a longer torso and shorter legs for my height (5'9"+), and the way the ND seat works is, as you bring the seat closer to the front (to help my short legs reaching the pedals), it also moves the seat higher. This means it eats away my headroom. I'm sure an aftermarket seat setup would eliminate this problem, but it makes the stock seat less than ideal for me.
At the end of the day, I couldn't pull the trigger (on an ND1 when it first came out) because I couldn't make the math work. My NC was lightly modded to suit my needs at the time, completely paid off, and sitting right at a comfortable zone on the depreciation curve. If I didn't already have my NC at the time, or if I were in a more comfortable financial position, I would have bought the ND despite all of its short comings. It was that good. I agonized over the decision for quite a while, and tried to come up with different ways to make it work, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it because of the numbers.
I didn't like the RF when I sat in it at the autoshow. The rear glass and associated enclosure make it seem too claustrophobic for me. But I don't have that problem with the soft top.
An ND friend with the Brembo front brakes can't sing enough praises for it as a stock brake setup. It even works well at the track. However, it also limits your wheel choice by quite a bit (due to clearance issues). There is no shortage of BBK for the ND though, including some that are very affordable (eg. FlyinMiata's ND LBBK). So personally, I wouldn't insist on having the factory Brembo.
i'm around 5'7" so headroom's never a concern
no child so don't anticipate issues with weekday duties...it does rule out easily transporting a bicycle on weekends though
i feel a RF is more practical in Vancouver and it's quite the looker...i still can't find info on the stock tires
i'm open to other modern japan-built sports cars in the 30k range
no s2000 because i want something not a honda for once...86 is too similar to what i have...fiat 124 spider's FCA turbo motor reliability is unknown... the Z is an aging gas hog and next-gen still few years out
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerbs
Anyone know if a s2000 or a ND miata pulls harder.
0-60 is roughly 1s faster...vtak bruh
supposedly slower in autox though
Anyone know if a s2000 or a ND miata pulls harder.
Stock for stock, at low end to mid range rpm, the current ND pulls harder. Once VTEC kicks in (yo!), however, the S2k would dominate. These results also seem consistent at the Street Touring autox as well (basically just your standard bolt-ons for mods) -- faster courses tends to favour S2k still, and lower top speed / more low-mid speed acceleration courses are better for the ND.
With the facelifted ND reportedly being in the 180+ hp range though, it is difficult to predict whether the S2k can maintain its high end dominance, and whether the ND can retain its low-mid range advantage.
if I want 400hp+ I wont be looking at miatas...and I'm not into heavy modding
the s2000 is amazing for a 20 year-old design but getting a bit long in the tooth...I like my tech like CarPlay/Android Auto...if I'm spending a fair bit i'm hoping to move out of the late 90s/early 2000s Honda design and get something from this decade
the pre-Chrysler merger multiair engine seems to be reliable but I still prefer NA
also not a fan of the front end, and it'll have worse resale value, not a bad thing but it uses last-gen NC Miata tranny
wonder if it'll get a bigger turbo in MY19 so it'll still edge out its refreshed MX-5 twin
i'll still go test it before I dismiss it though
Like you said, the NC Miata tranny in the 124 Spider isn't a bad thing -- it is just a bit notchy, whereas the ND's tranny is snick-snick smooth and fluid. However, also bear in mind that a batch of the early model year(s) ND is potentially affected by a transmission issue where the tranny may size without giving any noticeable warning. I forgot what the exact reason was that caused this, but Mazda has generally been very, very good in looking after the affected customers should it happen to them. A minimal number of questions is asked, and the owner is taken care of by having a new transmission installed at no cost to them (by the dealership). I don't remember which year(s) / production run the affected cars are though. Best to check Miata.net for that.
Also, with the massively up-rated engine, I'd expect the pre-facelift cars (ND1) to suffer a noticeable drop in market price. Yes, those are only 155hp cars, but IMO, mass production cars like this would always have a price that would make them into a great buy, and that might be the case with the ND1, once the ND2 comes out. So don't write off the pre-facelift cars just yet.
only the 2016 MX-5 was affected
yes there will be deep discounts on the existing stock...sales I read are really slow...the ND2 leaks certainly aren't helping
Also not Japanese but Boxster S is another driver focused car. Cayman is usually over 30k.
__________________ Victoria Car Assessments - Condition assessments (test drive, photos, deficiencies and summary). RS member references available. IG @touringteg
1998 Acura Integra Type R #0635
2017 Honda Civic Type R #01818
Last edited by TouringTeg; 05-21-2018 at 01:00 PM.
I own a ND1. The major advantages of the ND2 are the redesigned engine bits, which will most likely give it that power potential the ND1 just does not have. If more power is in your future, wait for the ND2.
Another huge huge huge thing that people don't really think about is the fact that the ND2 will apparently come with a telescoping steering wheel. It's a feature that crapboxes from 2001 have, but has never been available in a Miata.
I personally do not like the RF, as indeed it isn't a full convertible. On top of that, there is no roll bar option for that yet, and probably never will be. There just isn't the room available. As for tires, I'm not sure, but my 2016 Club with the BBS came with the Bridgestone S-001, which is firmly ok. Gets greasy after a few laps and grip drops off, but pretty durable. I have the brembos, and they haven't seemed to fade (yet). My usage is daily with handful of autox/track, and I don't really have any complaints, even on the stock fluid/pads. I toasted them after a year of track, so I've got some dual duty pads in there now. This might be also due to my lower skill/grip levels, so ymmv.
Personally I'm seriously considering trading up to the ND2 at some point, but I may be taking a huge depreciation hit, considering I've put a roll bar in there which means some holes in the tub and messed up interior trim plastics. But I will be doing a full cost analysis when the ND2 does hit the showrooms. Not sure how an 26 extra hp will feel, but maybe it will be a more rev happy motor, as the current engine does feel like it runs out of steam pretty early on.
Weekend trips are absolutely no problem, especially if you pack light. The trunk itself can handle two small carry-on luggage, and can fit maybe 3 or more small soft bags around the side. The parcel shelf area can carry some thin soft bags/ towels or what not as well.
tl:dr Wait for the ND2 if you want to spend an extra ~10k. A used ND1 will be the more financially wise decision.
Also not Japanese but Boxster S is another driver focused car. Cayman is usually over 30k.
I would go as far as to say the early model year Boxster, base or S model, are a good bang for buck, and for the most part, quite reliable and have hit the depreciation floor, but slowly rising again.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIC_BAWS
I literally do not plan on buying another vehicle in my lifetime, assuming it doesn't get written off.
As a price point a fellow autox competitor just bought an 01 Boxster S 6spd, black, 121kms, new clutch IMS etc for 14k at a dealer in the lower mainland.
__________________ Victoria Car Assessments - Condition assessments (test drive, photos, deficiencies and summary). RS member references available. IG @touringteg
1998 Acura Integra Type R #0635
2017 Honda Civic Type R #01818
Sounds about right for pricing. I'm actually in the market for a summer/secondary car, and went to look at a few Boxsters this past weekend. Looking to pick one up in a few week's time.
Sorry for the thread jack. Carry on.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIC_BAWS
I literally do not plan on buying another vehicle in my lifetime, assuming it doesn't get written off.
In the fall I looked at a silver 02 Boxster S 6spd, 210kms, for $6000. It was musty and was covered by a tarp so many scratches. Also a few dents and lots of deferred maintenance. IMS unknown. I think someone got it for 5k.
__________________ Victoria Car Assessments - Condition assessments (test drive, photos, deficiencies and summary). RS member references available. IG @touringteg
1998 Acura Integra Type R #0635
2017 Honda Civic Type R #01818
I own a ND1. The major advantages of the ND2 are the redesigned engine bits, which will most likely give it that power potential the ND1 just does not have. If more power is in your future, wait for the ND2.
Another huge huge huge thing that people don't really think about is the fact that the ND2 will apparently come with a telescoping steering wheel. It's a feature that crapboxes from 2001 have, but has never been available in a Miata.
I personally do not like the RF, as indeed it isn't a full convertible. On top of that, there is no roll bar option for that yet, and probably never will be. There just isn't the room available. As for tires, I'm not sure, but my 2016 Club with the BBS came with the Bridgestone S-001, which is firmly ok. Gets greasy after a few laps and grip drops off, but pretty durable. I have the brembos, and they haven't seemed to fade (yet). My usage is daily with handful of autox/track, and I don't really have any complaints, even on the stock fluid/pads. I toasted them after a year of track, so I've got some dual duty pads in there now. This might be also due to my lower skill/grip levels, so ymmv.
Personally I'm seriously considering trading up to the ND2 at some point, but I may be taking a huge depreciation hit, considering I've put a roll bar in there which means some holes in the tub and messed up interior trim plastics. But I will be doing a full cost analysis when the ND2 does hit the showrooms. Not sure how an 26 extra hp will feel, but maybe it will be a more rev happy motor, as the current engine does feel like it runs out of steam pretty early on.
Weekend trips are absolutely no problem, especially if you pack light. The trunk itself can handle two small carry-on luggage, and can fit maybe 3 or more small soft bags around the side. The parcel shelf area can carry some thin soft bags/ towels or what not as well.
tl:dr Wait for the ND2 if you want to spend an extra ~10k. A used ND1 will be the more financially wise decision.
I can see why telescopic wheel is a big deal for most...I feel your pain as the ND2 seems very obvious they've held back for the sake of the refresh...like standard backup cam, isn't that already mandated several years ago?
don't want a convertible anyways so the RF is right up my alley despite every reviewer saying to get the soft-top...hope the wind buffeting isn't as bad as it's made out to be
the factory roll hoops do seem inadequate...owners seem to suggest it depends on the event organizers whether it's allowed or not
initially I thought the satin stock wheels look more classy, but the BBS makes the ND look like a baby vette/viper from the side...damn!
yep looks like all the optioned wheels get the Potenza summers...good to know the S001 aren't Prius tires like the other guys
thanks for the input...but seriously I don't see many of you guys out and about...do you guys just drive to the canyon and beeline it home? I see more AMG and Maseratis than NDs...Miatas at grassroots are typically NB/NC
OT discussions: boxsters have been in the low teens as far back as I can remember...at least ones from last century
do the old BMW Z roadsters/coupes fall apart after a few laps? never see them discussed unless it's the Z4M
There's always an ND at Speed Fanatics track days and last Ridge track day there was atleast two. So some ND owners are starting to bring them out to track.
fucking miatas... why cant they ever make a tall person version? 6'2 and its impossible.
Was able to squeeze into a NC but having the top closed meant me bashing my skull on every bump.
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