Trump thread 2.0

[68style]

If what Hehe is saying was even remotely true, every rich person in the world would be living in Hong Kong or other places with basically 0% income tax.

But they don't... and they won't... your example doesn't make sense because Argentina =/= USA or Europe as far as living standards or surroundings or comfort or luxury. Not even close. They stayed in those places because of family or business and tolerated it... when something else came up, they left if they could afford to. This is hardly the case in USA or Europe.

[CivicBlues]

Argentina's decline in the 20th and 21st century was also predicated on political instability, successive millitary coups followed by government fiscal mismanagement. Wash, repeat. Not because poor people needed a leg up like those shithole countries Norway and Denmark /s. You'd think an Argentine would know his own history or at least not parrot some alt-right troll. BuT bUt muH SoCiAlIsM!!!!1111

[mikemhg]

Originally Posted by Hehe

Bahaha... Amazon is a trillion dollar company and paid ZERO taxes.

Don't blame the player, blame the game.

It's not just Trump, anyone in the upper echelon, all the billionaires, most politicians... etc... they all do that. Hell... many of my family do that through their corporate structures and they are nowhere near the billionaire rank.

If you are so naive that Biden and co don't employ similar taxation strategies and are basing your support on this, you are in fantasyland. Why don't the Dems attack this to death and bring up bills in the Congress (which they control) to address this? Because they are ALL FUCKING IN IT.

You think it's unfair and they are cheating the system... I'd tell you what... ANYONE CAN DO IT!

Just get up and go find a competent accountant who is well oiled in his/her craft and he can do it for you.

Whether your finances justify the cost, that's another topic.

You are literally posting exactly for verbatim what the conservative sycophants are posting under reddit/conservative

This has nothing to do with "Amazon" as a corportate entity, Trump himself personally is over $400 million dollars in debt. Under normal circumstances that would completely invalidate you as a presidential candidate, the real question is how was he attaining loans while being that much in debt, and who is he beholden to in terms of those debts?

That is a real issue here.

[mikemhg]

Anyone defending this garbage is being purely partisan, the "hate the game" argument clearly does not hold weight here, that's absolutely ridiculous.

It looks like Ivanka will also be drawn into this scandal, seems like the Trumps are continuing to evade estate taxes by writing off "services" and "consulting" fees by paying one another. The exact same way Trump avoided such taxes when inheriting the $400+ million from his father.

It's so bizarre to watch conservatives who espouse the idea of paying your fair share, to not abuse government payouts, to contribute equally to society, and then commit the mental gymnastics to defend a guy attempting to write off over $72 million in rebates by falsifying his taxes.

I don't understand how logically anyone can defend such criminality.

[mikemhg]

Hehe, you post this in the Canadian politics thread:

"What I don’t agree is that liberals just hand out money instead of taking the time to understand what they need to live a life with less resistance from their struggles."

Alright, so you claim you hate when "liberals" hand out money.

Yet here you are defending a man that has clearly been committing fraud on his taxes, eliciting an undeserved "handout" from the government.

You and I both know that tax laws and the tax code has been written and influenced heavily by policy wonks and lobbyists within the financial sector. Not a single person would claim that the tax system is written ethically or fairly within the states, and clearly is skewed to benefit the wealthy, and those which dabble within the investment sector of the economy. No one would claim that as otherwise, heck even Warren Buffet who benefits from said system will agree with that, and has said so, among others.

So you have no problems for handouts if it's for the group in which you believe yourself to be a part of (conservatives, right wing, Republican, use whatever adjective you see fit), but a "liberal" handout is a problem?

Do you not see the odd dichotomy to your arguments here?

[Manic!]

Someone upset at liberials just handing out money?

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-...trump-promised

President Trump promised this week to send cards worth $200 to seniors to help them pay for their prescription drugs, but it's unclear how he will be able to pull it off — or how legal it is.

If he can, that's $6.6 billion to a key voting bloc weeks before Election Day.

Trying to bribe voters with $200 debit cards for perscriptions. But it's really just a big goverment hand out to big farma.

[underscore]

Originally Posted by Hehe

Again, it's the system, not the person.

If the flaws are only in the system, and you think the results from both parties will be exactly the same, why are you so strongly supporting one and so against the other?

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

Argentina's decline in the 20th and 21st century was also predicated on political instability, successive millitary coups followed by government fiscal mismanagement. Wash, repeat. Not because poor people needed a leg up like those shithole countries Norway and Denmark /s. You'd think an Argentine would know his own history or at least not parrot some alt-right troll. BuT bUt muH SoCiAlIsM!!!!1111

Oh come on... you've never been there. Please don't pretend you know what's going on just because you read a quick history lesson about Argentina economy. My family lived through the worst from the early 80s to the economy disaster in the early 2000s and until now.

It boils down to one thing: Peronismo.

They introduced a fuck'd up version of socialism when the educational level and moral level of the population is clearly not there.

Countries where socialism had success, like Norway/Denmark was because even with a crazy social program in place, people felt responsible... no only to themselves, but to the country as a whole.

Argentina, otoh, was just selfish. People would rather cheat every way they can so they can all receive the social subsidy. And in EVERY election, it boils down to who can offer the better "bribe" to the people.

They elected Macri prior to this election because it wasn't working anymore. Macri tried to fix it. Then the people don't want to suck up and deal with the mess, so they elected again a Peronismo-based president... because they have accostumed to the idea of getting paid by being lazy. Now suddenly you want them to all go to work and cut their benefits, they actually feel that you are trying to steal what belongs to them.

So, until you really experience in your life, what kind of fucked up life would lefty bring, please don't tell me that it's NOT liberalism the problem.

Sure... communism is the perfect form of socialism... and somehow no country managed to make it work. Even China is a form of fake communism with a major capitalism influence for its success. If Mao had lived for few more years, China would not be what it is today.

[Eff-1]

Originally Posted by Hehe

Again, it's the system, not the person.

I don't believe that's the point here.

Every president for the past 40 years has made his tax information public. This transparency prevents the president from making policies that benefit himself personally.

Trump has done nothing but fight the release of this information since day one.

As far as whether or not Trump is any worse than any other rich guy who writes off everything as a business expense, there's this:

In 2017, the average federal income rate for the highest-earning .001 percent of tax filers — that is, the most affluent 1/100,000th slice of the population — was 24.1 percent, according to the I.R.S.

Over the past two decades, Mr. Trump has paid about $400 million less in combined federal income taxes than a very wealthy person who paid the average for that group each year.

His tax avoidance also sets him apart from past presidents.

Mr. Trump may be the wealthiest U.S. president in history. Yet he has often paid less in taxes than other recent presidents. Barack Obama and George W. Bush each regularly paid more than $100,000 a year — and sometimes much more — in federal income taxes while in office.

Mr. Trump, by contrast, is running a federal government to which he has contributed almost no income tax revenue in many years.

[CivicBlues]

Originally Posted by Hehe

Oh come on... you've never been there. Please don't pretend you know what's going on just because you read a quick history lesson about Argentina economy. My family lived through the worst from the early 80s to the economy disaster in the early 2000s and until now.

It boils down to one thing: Peronismo.

They introduced a fuck'd up version of socialism when the educational level and moral level of the population is clearly not there.

Countries where socialism had success, like Norway/Denmark was because even with a crazy social program in place, people felt responsible... no only to themselves, but to the country as a whole.

Argentina, otoh, was just selfish. People would rather cheat every way they can so they can all receive the social subsidy. And in EVERY election, it boils down to who can offer the better "bribe" to the people.

They elected Macri prior to this election because it wasn't working anymore. Macri tried to fix it. Then the people don't want to suck up and deal with the mess, so they elected again a Peronismo-based president... because they have accostumed to the idea of getting paid by being lazy. Now suddenly you want them to all go to work and cut their benefits, they actually feel that you are trying to steal what belongs to them.

So, until you really experience in your life, what kind of fucked up life would lefty bring, please don't tell me that it's NOT liberalism the problem.

Sure... communism is the perfect form of socialism... and somehow no country managed to make it work. Even China is a form of fake communism with a major capitalism influence for its success. If Mao had lived for few more years, China would not be what it is today.

I have been to Argentina - Buenos Aires is a monument to peaking early. I am still amazed that in 1930 it had the 10th highest GDP in the world. Still had a good time though, although I think the steak there is overrated.

Anyways, you just admitted that it's a cultural issue rather than one of actual government policy. So perhaps instead of blanket statements like "socialism doesn't work" and "lefties are stupid", each individual nation's situation should be taken into account. "Liberalism doesn't work" Guess what? YOU LIVE IN A FUCKING LIBERAL COUNTRY! Otherwise you sound like those Conservative idiots who say that the US is a few years away from being Venezuela.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by Eff-1

I don't believe that's the point here.

Every president for the past 40 years has made his tax information public. This transparency prevents the president from making policies that benefit himself personally.

Trump has done nothing but fight the release of this information since day one.

As far as whether or not Trump is any worse than any other rich guy who writes off everything as a business expense, there's this:

Point me a US law that requires US presidents to provide their tax fillings.

Trump, being a billionaire would have a complex tax structure and system in place... why would one provide such information just so their opponent could take things out of context?

Let's just say hypothetically he has written off x amount for losses on his branding value, which is a perfectly legal way. Every brand, Athelet stars... etc all do it. But what would opponent say?

Oh, why do you get to claim x millions of losses because of branding valuation... blah blah... general folks just don't understand it and would just feel the person is cheating on taxes... when he's not... it's just how the taxation laws are written to allow such claims.

Again, you are basing your "justification" because other presidents do it. But when did we ever have a billionaire US presidents? As far as I'm aware, Trump is the only one... adjusted for inflation to crack that number.

You are against Trump, I get it... but asking him to present the worst side of him (albeit legal) so that it's fair? Where's the fairness? You don't see Biden going to an independent institution to have his mental state checked... why would he?

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

I have been to Argentina - Buenos Aires is a monument to peaking early. I am still amazed that in 1930 it had the 10th highest GDP in the world. Still had a good time though, although I think the steak there is overrated.

Anyways, you just admitted that it's a cultural issue rather than one of actual government policy. So perhaps instead of blanket statements like "socialism doesn't work" and "lefties are stupid", each individual nation's situation should be taken into account. "Liberalism doesn't work" Guess what? YOU LIVE IN A FUCKING LIBERAL COUNTRY! Otherwise you sound like those Conservative idiots who say that the US is a few years away from being Venezuela.

Si realmente estuviste viviendo en Argentina, estoy seguro q puedas entender cualkier merda q estoy poniendo aca si?

Si no sabes, callate.

Viajar a Argentina es muy diferente q vivir ahi. Capiche?

[CivicBlues]

Did I say I lived in Argentina? I live in Canada, a liberal country, and one that works pretty fucking well thank you very much.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

Did I say I lived in Argentina? I live in Canada, a liberal country, and one that works pretty fucking well thank you very much.

And that is exactly why... you never lived there... you can't possibly understand what the regular folks in Argentina have to live through.

There are many good people there. Many of my families, friends, and old schoolmates, acquaintances are all there... struggling.

You are trying to interpret their problem from a Canadian perspective... it just doesn't work. The culture is different, the general social value is different.... everything is different.

What you wrote, in the part where I quoted clearly showed me a privileged first world dude trying to say "ahhh, you guys have all this shit because you don't do this... blah blah blah."

The fact is you have no idea what's like to be living in Argentina.

[CivicBlues]

You're absolutely right, I was just a tourist I have no idea what it's like to be living in Argentina. I do though, know what it's like to live in a much poorer country (Indonesia) and also living in much more liberal egalitarian country like Canada. But that's totally besides the point. Your wholesale dismissal of "liberalism" is what bugs me, as I've seen what an overreaction to it does to the populace you just have to look at the dumpster fire down south.

[Eff-1]

Originally Posted by Hehe

Point me a US law that requires US presidents to provide their tax fillings.

Trump, being a billionaire would have a complex tax structure and system in place... why would one provide such information just so their opponent could take things out of context?

Let's just say hypothetically he has written off x amount for losses on his branding value, which is a perfectly legal way. Every brand, Athelet stars... etc all do it. But what would opponent say?

Oh, why do you get to claim x millions of losses because of branding valuation... blah blah... general folks just don't understand it and would just feel the person is cheating on taxes... when he's not... it's just how the taxation laws are written to allow such claims.

Again, you are basing your "justification" because other presidents do it. But when did we ever have a billionaire US presidents? As far as I'm aware, Trump is the only one... adjusted for inflation to crack that number.

You are against Trump, I get it... but asking him to present the worst side of him (albeit legal) so that it's fair? Where's the fairness? You don't see Biden going to an independent institution to have his mental state checked... why would he?

Well, I never said there was a law.

So why should he do it? See my earlier comment:

"This transparency prevents the president from making policies that benefit himself personally."

And actually, the NYT confirms that's exactly what's been happening.

Trump may be the only billionaire, but there have been many millionaire presidents to take office, all of whom have likely written off all kinds of things --- but still disclosed their finances.

You keep bringing it back to the point of his tax writeoffs are legal (allegedly, only the IRS can confirm that). So there's no news here.

But actually, the real news here is how this whole episode further reflects on the kind of person Donald Trump truly is and his personal values and morals

[Hehe]

Again, it's a competition for a job.

If you were interviewing for a job and they ask you the part that you are very worst at, even though it might be irrelevant to the job, or you can't find a way to explain it so that the interviewers would understand. Would you bring it up? Or would you hide it as much as you can and only present the part you are actually good at and relevant to the job?

That goes for both Trump's taxation and Biden's mental state...

Does how Trump optimize his taxes have anything to do with him being president? Maybe... but it's not a major part.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

You're absolutely right, I was just a tourist I have no idea what it's like to be living in Argentina. I do though, know what it's like to live in a much poorer country (Indonesia) and also living in much more liberal egalitarian country like Canada. But that's totally besides the point. Your wholesale dismissal of "liberalism" is what bugs me, as I've seen what an overreaction to it does to the populace you just have to look at the dumpster fire down south.

I dismiss liberalism because after many years of being one, I realize that it cannot work. This is specially true after I had kids.

All the proposal that liberalism take is just pushing the problem to our future generations. Having a kid a trying to be at least a responsible dad... is that whatever fucked up I might face in my life, I'd make sure those fucked ups don't affect my kids.

[68style]

Your kid can enjoy a conservative upbringing then, with no healthcare coverage, church every Sunday lest he go to hell and the chance of getting his head blown off for going to knock on his neighbour’s door to borrow a rake. Fun times.

(yes I’m being extreme but so are you)

[mikemhg]

This man ran on the very guise of "freeloading" Americans, of accountability, the fact that migrants and the poor don't pay their fair share of taxes, and that they should be contributing to society.

That was Trump's defining message. He's been shown to be no different, if not far worse than the very people he has vilified during his campaign, and thereafter.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...oocher/616516/

Would you be friends or surround yourself with a person who has lied this much to the public, and his supporters? There is no denying the man is a pathological liar, yet you still have certain segment of the population looking to defend him.

Where is the line drawn between "sticking it to the libs", and one's own moral compass?

[StylinRed]

One thing everyone has to remember is, we don't know if the NYT article is true, or more precisely, that their evidence is

The times have gotten things wrong before, and they also hate Trump as much as he hates them

This could very well be a smear/shame campaign to compel Trump to finally release his taxes

Either way its great fodder to use against him, not sure it'll do much though, ppl's minds are probably made up

[Hondaracer]

There was an article posted with an image showing 5 of the last 6 presidents paid 250k in taxes or less during their presidency. I understand that most probably did not have the empire Trump does but none of them were close to your “average citizen” long before any of them became president.

Also, trump is writing off rediculous losses during these years

I don’t really get where this “outrage” is coming that he pays no taxes, relative amounts to former presidents this is a complete non-issue imo. Seemingly the only thing trump was hiding is what a poor business man he was/is

[SkinnyPupp]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

One thing everyone has to remember is, we don't know if the NYT article is true, or more precisely, that their evidence is

The times have gotten things wrong before, and they also hate Trump as much as he hates them

This could very well be a smear/shame campaign to compel Trump to finally release his taxes

Either way its great fodder to use against him, not sure it'll do much though, ppl's minds are probably made up

For NYT to fabricate a story like this could literally end their existence. That's a pretty big accusation

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by SkinnyPupp

For NYT to fabricate a story like this could literally end their existence. That's a pretty big accusation

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...New_York_Times

[SkinnyPupp]

Originally Posted by Hehe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...New_York_Times

Did you read ANY of what you just posted?