REVscene - Vancouver Automotive Forum

Excelsis · 09-25-2018, 10:03 PM

Spoiler!

Considering purchasing a diesel truck and so far my sights are set on duramax 08-12..

What are your experiences with diesel trucks - maintenance, and regular upkeep?

welfare · 09-30-2018, 02:29 AM

Personally, never been a fan of gm. The duramax is a great engine, but just don't don't like what it's encased in.

08-12 should have dpf and regen, but still prior to scr and exhaust fluid.
Honestly, a solid 80% of the issues i see come through the door are emissions related. I'm not even exaggerating.
If it's out of warranty, delete it. Diesels and emissions are like oil and water.

I'm a certified diesel tech for Ford. Honestly, I'm not a loyalist. I like what i like. but I've always just found the fit, finish, interior, and overall quality of Ford light duties to be slightly better than gm and much better than Chrysler.
The 6.7 scorpion borrows a lot of engineering cues from the duramax. Aluminum heads, similar displacement, they also run the same cp4 injection pump as the latter lml duramax, which is very unforgiving to even microns of debris.usually caused by water build up/rust internally.
And if the pump grenades it sends its trash through the rest of the fuel system. Which means replacement of the entire high pressure system is required. that's pump, lines, injectors, drop the tank and thoroughly flush prior to replacement. You're looking at a 20hr job plus $5k in parts.
Accurate diesel makes a "disaster prevention kit" which reroutes fuel after the volume control valve so a blown pump won't damage the rest of the system. Good insurance.
Or you can buy a conversion kit to revert back to a cp3 pump (only needed for 11+ lml duramax). The cp3 is a good pump. Very durable. Much better design, imo.

What are you using it for? I see more engine issues on trucks that don't get worked. Biggest issue on modern diesels with operational emissions systems is low egt's. Low egt's produce a lot of carbon and soot. This restricts egr, cokes the veins in the variable geometry turbo,and overloads the dpf by not allowing for complete regens.
Essentially, high egt's keep everything clean.

Diesel is hygroscopic. And as I'd mentioned prior, water in the fuel on a common rail diesel can be catastrophic. Not only for the fuel system, but the engine itself. If debris hangs an injector open, it can quickly blow a hole through a piston. Microns is all it takes.
Be wise to invest in a good water separator filtration system. The factory systems aren't very efficient. Or at the very least drain the factory separator every few weeks.

If you have any further questions, i love talking diesel, so don't hesitate.
It really is its own world.

welfare · 09-30-2018, 03:17 AM

just pitching this But a lot of time and effort went into design of that Ford 6.7 scorpion engine. Aluminum heads, inboard mounted exhaust manifolds, dual profile turbo compressor, two separate independent cooling systems for better regulation, rocker arm oil feeds, compacted graphite iron block. It really is built like a brick shithouse.

Ford had to knock it out the park to redeem for the previous two (misunderstood, IMHO) international engines.
And i think they really did if you compare technology with an lml duramax.

E-40six · 09-30-2018, 12:54 PM

They dont need much in terms of maintenance and upkeep

just your regular Fuel Filters every other oil change which I do at 10,000km.
I run my trucks for work right at their GVW max and they rack up milage fast.
The only truck I don't work hard is my duramax and thats my daily to my yard and taking the wife out.

I've owned a
7.3L IDI 400,000km
7.3L first gen powerstroke 450,000km,
International DT466e 420,000km (inframed at 330,000km)
06LLY Duramax 310,000km with PPE Tuner on it
'17 9L ISL DPF DEF Cummins 70,000km

as you can see, They're all high mileage work horses and I've taken care of the motors all the same

My next truck would be another Duramax as formula for that engine has been the same since 2000 with upgrades and revisions thru the years
its also designed by Isuzu who are known for their diesel relability

Jayboogz · 09-30-2018, 01:35 PM

ran a 03 silverado 2500 duramax hit 350k in 12 years
i use it to haul seafood from vancouver to tofino weekly
only real issue i had was changing the alternator and new batteries because i wasnt fishing for a good 2 months during the winter and the truck wasnt being used. other than that nothing else fucked up with regular maintenance. gas guage fucked up in 05.

im on my 2nd silverado
2015 3500 duramax

i just threw air bags on dis bitch for better stability when im carrying heavy..
got 90k on this in almost 3 years.. i bought it in december 2015

love the duramax with the allison transmission.

its expensive. the interior is shit but its reliable as fuck engines a tank for what i use. i tow my boat i load up the bed with 5000 + lbs of shit heading back to vancouver always has power.

the only reason i upgraded trucks is because all of the heavy salt water in my truck bed. the body was starting to rust like crazy.. engine wise still ran great on the 03.

welfare · 09-30-2018, 02:40 PM

^^^no injectors that whole time? On an lb7??
You got lucky my friend.

If looking at anything 08+, They're all relatively similarly priced i think (gm, Ford, Chrysler).
The complexity of emissions and fuel systems, the creature comforts.
2018 f350 platinum is about $100k! I imagine a loaded Silverado isn't much different.
There are literally more modules relating to the drivers seat than there were on the entire truck ten years ago.
The sealed headlamp is $2k If an led blows. $2k to change a headlight. Just wait till they come off warranty. Yikes.

Jas29 · 09-30-2018, 03:20 PM

Friend had a 08 Duramax (LMM) he had no issues with the truck other than the tranny started to slip after awhile. Truck was deleted and tuned heavily. 6.5inch lift with 37s

Obviously with those mods the stock tranny wasn't going to keep up

The previous generation motor (LBZ) is considered better if you want to make more power

^^
My friend test drove a f450 it broke down within 10 kms had to get towed back to the dealership it said something about low fuel pressure. I wouldn't want to mess around with a new diesel thats why I bought a first gen

welfare · 09-30-2018, 04:27 PM

That's why i work for Ford now. Always busy! Hahaha. Jk...

Problem with earlier mechanical injection trucks is everyone wants a telephone number for them.
For the technology and age, it's hard to justify. Then again, I'm not paying the repair bills

GabAlmighty · 09-30-2018, 06:23 PM

If you can snag yourself a common rail 5.9 Cummins that isn't beat to shit I would jump on that, or a early gen 12v. Or a 7.3/6.9 Ford. I like old shit and those are in my opinion the best diesel motors made.

Friend of mine here as a 08 duramax and he drives it fairly hard and hasn't had any issues in his 100'ish km's of ownership.

For the love of all that is holy in this world do not get a 24v Cummins. I am slightly biased in that view as I had an extremely bad experience with one.

TjAlmeida · 09-30-2018, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GabAlmighty

If you can snag yourself a common rail 5.9 Cummins that isn't beat to shit I would jump on that, or a early gen 12v. Or a 7.3/6.9 Ford. I like old shit and those are in my opinion the best diesel motors made.

Friend of mine here as a 08 duramax and he drives it fairly hard and hasn't had any issues in his 100'ish km's of ownership.

For the love of all that is holy in this world do not get a 24v Cummins. I am slightly biased in that view as I had an extremely bad experience with one.

You started off with suggesting a common rail 5.9 Cummins, then finish with don't ever get a 24v Cummins??????

While I think Ford has taken a big step forward in their most recent two generations, I can appreciate the ease of working on a Cummins. Inline 6 there is just so much room for activities, and no dealing with cab removal for major repairs. If you just plan to work it and only do deletes get a Ford, if you plan on working on it yourself, be patient and wait for a 06/07 dodge. Also bonus is if you like shifting gears the dodges come with the stout g56 manual trans.

GabAlmighty · 10-01-2018, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TjAlmeida

You started off with suggesting a common rail 5.9 Cummins, then finish with don't ever get a 24v Cummins??????

Ya the 03+ 5.9's are the desirable ones, referred to as the common rail 5.9. I believe they made a lot of changes from the 98-02 gen. Please correct me if i'm wrong as it's been a while and honestly I don't really know all that much haha.

welfare · 10-01-2018, 09:59 AM

^^correct. when people say 24v they are usually referring to the first gen, with the notorious vp44 pump.
Common rail 5.9 is the 03-07.5 i believe.
Then the 08 6.7. Which, iirc, had head gasket issues, and number six cylinder Cooling problems Iirc. Been awhile since i worked on them tho.
Also, the auto transmissions were very underrated and prone to failure. Not sure about the later ones tho.

hud 91gt · 10-01-2018, 10:18 AM

Are the Ford 7.3’s alright? Since I live in truck land now, maybe I should get a truck.

Bouncing Bettys · 10-01-2018, 10:55 AM

The Champ says to take it to Bernhausen.

welfare · 10-01-2018, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hud 91gt

Are the Ford 7.3’s alright? Since I live in truck land now, maybe I should get a truck.

They are reliable. Because they're simple And low tech. And built pretty tough for what little Performance is demanded from them.
And they aren't equipped with any emissions devices.
That's why everybody swears by them.
There are some common points of failure but they are all relatively easy and inexpensive fixes. For the most part.

That being said, i personally don't see the attraction. Not for the price people want.
I know I'll get absolutely railed on here for saying this, but dollar per pound, I'll take a 6.0 any day.
Much better technology and performance.
They are much more sensitive tho, to put it lightly. But you get a lot more for a lot less typically.

But i guess for the average Joe, the 7.3 is a good truck.
The 6.0 is kinda like the rotary of diesel trucks. 95% of the community will claim they're a complete pos. While the other 5% claim they're far superior. These are the hobbyist type i suppose. The ones who like to go in-depth.

welfare · 10-01-2018, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bouncing Bettys

The Champ says to take it to Bernhausen.

Hahahaha. He's actually my brother.
Bernhausen... Not bro Jake

fliptuner · 10-01-2018, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hud 91gt

Are the Ford 7.3’s alright? Since I live in truck land now, maybe I should get a truck.

Your neighbor's selling one. Lol
97, 250HD, 5spd, 4x4, LB, EXT, rear airbags, 330k
Ugly and 2nd grinds on the downshift. All new front end.

GabAlmighty · 10-01-2018, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welfare

^^correct. when people say 24v they are usually referring to the first gen, with the notorious vp44 pump.
Common rail 5.9 is the 03-07.5 i believe.
Then the 08 6.7. Which, iirc, had head gasket issues, and number six cylinder Cooling problems Iirc. Been awhile since i worked on them tho.
Also, the auto transmissions were very underrated and prone to failure. Not sure about the later ones tho.

That's what I thought. Ya... That vp44 is a POS. Best motor you can build is a 24v with a p-pump conversion, all the flow of the 24v but with the mechanical goodness of a 12v. Ya the 6.7's like to blow head gaskets, especially if deleted I believe (one or two of our tow trucks in Yellowknife have blown head gaskets).

Quote:

Originally Posted by hud 91gt

Are the Ford 7.3’s alright? Since I live in truck land now, maybe I should get a truck.

Yes. If you just need a diesel that's going to start every morning and tow heavy shit. But don't get it if you wanna go fast. Me personally when I get back into a diesel it's going to be a 7.3/6.9 or a 12v. BUT they are getting expensive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by welfare

That being said, i personally don't see the attraction. Not for the price people want.
I know I'll get absolutely railed on here for saying this, but dollar per pound, I'll take a 6.0 any day.
Much better technology and performance.
They are much more sensitive tho, to put it lightly. But you get a lot more for a lot less typically.

But i guess for the average Joe, the 7.3 is a good truck.
The 6.0 is kinda like the rotary of diesel trucks. 95% of the community will claim they're a complete pos. While the other 5% claim they're far superior. These are the hobbyist type i suppose. The ones who like to go in-depth.

Had a friend at my old job who had a 6.0 and loved it, mind you it was built to the tits and making in the 700 range whp. He just recently did a full bottom end build to it, it's nuts. But he's also replaced the head gasket more times than he can count and can get the cab off in less an hour haha.

My $0.02 is you gotta be a decent backyard mechanic with a 6.0, or it's going to get expensive.

welfare · 10-01-2018, 12:38 PM

Biggest thing with the 6.0 is monitoring your vitals. Nearly all the problems are trickle down from something minor.

A weak charging system will take out the ficm. And a weak ficm will take down the injectors. So a bad battery or weak alternator left unchecked just cost someone upwards of $5k.

A plugged oil cooler will take out the egr cooler which will take out the head gaskets. All caused by a poorly maintained cooling system.

They are sensitive. The 7.3, not so much.
First thing any 6.0 owner should invest in is a monitor.
Actually, get an alarm first. Cuz those trucks get stolen like it's going out of style lol.

Preferably 05-07, as they have the coil spring front end, nicer grille,headlights, and bumper, and much more reliable injection pump.

Biggest issue (aside from emissions) with newer diesels is fuel quality. The ultra low sulphur diesel has removed much of the lubricity. You add water build up to that and you have big problems.
This is actually especially true for older diesels that were designed to run on the high sulphur fuel.
If you have an older diesel, run an additive

Nardogr3y · 10-01-2018, 10:03 PM

When i was working in heavy construction my 2005 Silverado LBZ durmax 6.6 4 inch lift tuned and exhaust was a beast this thing towed and hauled all day, what was replaced were battery belts and some minor front end replacement either then that there were just some annoying interior rattle and a failing window motor

Jas29 · 10-02-2018, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welfare

^^correct. when people say 24v they are usually referring to the first gen, with the notorious vp44 pump.
Common rail 5.9 is the 03-07.5 i believe.
Then the 08 6.7. Which, iirc, had head gasket issues, and number six cylinder Cooling problems Iirc. Been awhile since i worked on them tho.
Also, the auto transmissions were very underrated and prone to failure. Not sure about the later ones tho.

Never heard of anyone call a 1st gen a 24v as it has a Boshe VE6 injection pump and only has 12 valves

A 24 valve is a 98.5- 2003 (VP44 pump)
2003+ is a common rail

A 6 L is not a reliable truck lol

Personally I would get a Duramax

Jas29 · 10-02-2018, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nardogr3y

When i was working in heavy construction my 2005 Silverado LBZ durmax 6.6 4 inch lift tuned and exhaust was a beast this thing towed and hauled all day, what was replaced were battery belts and some minor front end replacement either then that there were just some annoying interior rattle and a failing window motor

2005 Duramax came with a LLY

welfare · 10-02-2018, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jas29

Never heard of anyone call a 1st gen a 24v as it has a Boshe VE6 injection pump and only has 12 valves

A 24 valve is a 98.5- 2003 (VP44 pump)
2003+ is a common rail

A 6 L is not a reliable truck lol

Personally I would get a Duramax

when i said first gen, i meant first gen of the 24v. sorry, though that was obvious.

and i never said the 6.0 was reliable. i said dollar per pound they offer much better technology and performance than a 7.3, but that they were more sensitive.

but we could debate the reliability. here's a fun fact not many are familiar with:
the 2007 model/year 6.0 (last year) had less warranty claims than any given year of the 7.3.

Excelsis · 10-02-2018, 10:33 PM

so many mixed opinions

So far from what i've gathered from different forums and videos.. duramax 2007+ up are reliable engines and typically don't need much except regular maintenance.

dodge engines last long as well but transmission fails

newer ford trucks diesels are shit but 7.3L older engine is good, however transmission fails somewhere 300-500k.

Hoping to get a truck that can get to 1 million kms comfortably with regular maintenance

welfare · 10-02-2018, 11:37 PM

If you want something that's going to get you 1m km, with only regular maintenance/wear and tear, your best bet would be something older.

A 7.3 idi, 12v cummins, or even a 6.2 gm. Simple machines They'll last forever. Just don't expect much when you hit the skinny pedal.