Getting audited by icbc for underdeclaring car value

[Mr.Money]

what a Shake down,you guys shouldn't bend over for them at all,Requesting banking information on the sale price and getting that document printed takes like 2 minutes.
but ICBC wanting 1500 digging in your pockets,get the fuck out of my life,i'd never vow to that.


pricks.

[68style]

^
To be fair, it's not ICBC getting the money... it goes to the provincial government, ICBC is just the muscle. Your beef is with the province getting a windfall in these situations

[asma123]

So let’s say I buy a 2019 brand new Toyota 4Runner for $56k plus tax ($6720). 4years down the road I want to sell it. Price is now what 30k? Person that buys it has to pay taxes on the 30k ($3600) so realistically in the life cycle of 1 car they’ve already collected enough or more to buy another brand new one PLUS tax here and there ie gas tax. Pretty ridiculous. Taxation should only be once per item. This is just plain theft.
I remember before the HST you could buy used vehicles and only have to pay one tax unless bought from a dealer. Somehow after the HST tax on used cars was changed to the 12% and never reversed back once they took the HST away and reintroduced the gst and pst

[daval]

to add to this.

If you declared that the car has mechanical problem or body damage. You will have 3 months from when u purchased the vehicle to repair them. Normal wear and tear items don't count. Failure to proof of repairs, you will have to pay the taxes according to their book value (which is way high).

Moreover, if you try to proof that the market value is not as high as what they stated by using CL and autotrader for sale ads, that won't work as well.

[Jmac]

Originally Posted by asma123

So let’s say I buy a 2019 brand new Toyota 4Runner for $56k plus tax ($6720). 4years down the road I want to sell it. Price is now what 30k? Person that buys it has to pay taxes on the 30k ($3600) so realistically in the life cycle of 1 car they’ve already collected enough or more to buy another brand new one PLUS tax here and there ie gas tax. Pretty ridiculous. Taxation should only be once per item. This is just plain theft.
I remember before the HST you could buy used vehicles and only have to pay one tax unless bought from a dealer. Somehow after the HST tax on used cars was changed to the 12% and never reversed back once they took the HST away and reintroduced the gst and pst

GST has never applied to private vehicle sales.

Pre-HST: 5% GST + 7% PST on commercial used vehicle sales / 7% PST on private used vehicle sales
HST: 12% HST on commercial used vehicle sales / 12% HST on private used vehicle sales
Post-HST: 5% GST + 7% PST on commercial used vehicle sales / 12% PST on private used vehicle sales

[Badhobz]

how can we go about changing this bullshit? do we start writing letters to our local MLA's?

[68style]

Everyone complains about the real estate cartel here, there's a smaller cartel that lobbies the government hard called the New Car Dealers Association of BC https://www.newcardealers.ca/

They're the ones responsible for pushing through a 12% tax on private sales as they argued it was an unfair advantage people had selling privately since dealers had to charge 12% while private was only 7%.

IMO there is zero chance the government is giving up that cash cow. They also used to be super lenient on gifts, you could gift a vehicle to anyone before and pay no tax if you both signed a letter stating your relation to one another even if it was just between friends (motorcycle guys would do this a lot, trade bikes for a year and trade back), but since the HST came in/got scrapped and it went to 12% now they only allow you to do it if it's parent<->child, husband<->wife and pretty much nothing else.

[underscore]

I assume they're the same ones that made it so the tax is only on the difference for a direct trade. Which is bullshit, most people selling a vehicle are going to replace it with another one, so it's still a "trade" in effect, just not as directly.

[Hehe]

I don't think the gov't has any intention of letting this cash cow go.

However, I do think it's a complete BS of 12% PST on private sales WHILE they still get to arbitrate the "fair price".

What if I want to sell my 30k for 20k? I might be looking to unload it ASAP for an emergency and some lucky guy had the opportunity to get a great deal.

This is another BS with the "leveling the playing field" excuse. Used car dealers already pay less for their vehicles because they'd only pay the LOWEST price they can if someone were to sell the car to the dealership.

Heck, it's even more BS that if you sell your car to a dealership and you get tax credit if you buy a new vehicle while you don't with a private deal. If they were really to be leveling the playing field, it should be something available to every deal, private or commercial.

[Great68]

Their definition of "family" pisses me off. I'm as close to some of my aunts/uncles as I am to my mom & dad. Yet they can't gift me a vehicle.

Stupid.

My Mustang was a 18th birthday/high school grad gift from my aunt. Granted it needed lots of work, but if if it was now I'd have to pay some tax on that? Fuck off.

[Traum]

Is anyone surprised that the taxman wants a cut on everything we spend / do?

[Bouncing Bettys]

Someone should audit ICBC for undervaluing vehicles being written off. nsrs but srs

[Y2K_o__o]

12% is a joke

The tax never went down to 7% as what it used to be even the HST was scrapped.......

[dark0821]

i wonder what if you could just tell icbc the other party just gave some other physical items as a trade in. Just like when you trade in a car to a dealership and the trade in is tax exempt.

Write it out as sold vehicle for Hermes Bag and cash on top lolol?

[wing_woo]

Originally Posted by dark0821

i wonder what if you could just tell icbc the other party just gave some other physical items as a trade in. Just like when you trade in a car to a dealership and the trade in is tax exempt.

Write it out as sold vehicle for Hermes Bag and cash on top lolol?

They'll tax you on the value of the Hermes Bag as well or whatever they deem the total value you paid including traded items.

[The Producer]

i just realized that this could be another reason d-bags post fake CL ads all the time.

Maybe they've been audited and are trying to show ICBC comparables to justify the fake sale prices they've put on transfer sheets.

[heremath676]

just got a letter from ministry of finance to provide documents to support the lower price i payed than the average market value of motorcycle i recently purchased .They wont count the icbc transfer form as bill of sale ..they want another written one .the guy who sold me the bike had to leave the country immediately and hence gave me for a good deal.i have no way contacting him now as he is not living in Canada anymore.i don't have proof of repairs done as i did service myself mostly basic service,new battery and oil changes and tune up.they want repair receipts from licenced mechanic .
not sure what to do in this situation.

[whitev70r]

Here is ICBC chasing after hundreds or thousands of dollar, meanwhile wastes in other areas go into millions and billions.

ICBC paid out nearly $2B to law firms in previous fiscal year
https://globalnews.ca/news/6092920/i...s-fiscal-year/

Reminds me of CRA agents auditing middle class families who make < $100K while billionaires are hiding millions offshore.

[trollface]

Is 2b a lot? What are others paying? Seems sensational with no comparison.

[Y2K_o__o]

Originally Posted by asma123

So let’s say I buy a 2019 brand new Toyota 4Runner for $56k plus tax ($6720). 4years down the road I want to sell it. Price is now what 30k? Person that buys it has to pay taxes on the 30k ($3600) so realistically in the life cycle of 1 car they’ve already collected enough or more to buy another brand new one PLUS tax here and there ie gas tax. Pretty ridiculous. Taxation should only be once per item. This is just plain theft.
I remember before the HST you could buy used vehicles and only have to pay one tax unless bought from a dealer. Somehow after the HST tax on used cars was changed to the 12% and never reversed back once they took the HST away and reintroduced the gst and pst

Charging tax when changing hand is just a joke. The tax collected could worth more than the vehicle value at the end.

When they took HST away, PST should also be taken away too. The dealership argued that it wasn't a level playing field, but they didn't realize they have the trade-in tax deduction unlike private seller.

[yray]

not sure if off topic but if I trade in my car at a dealer to use as down payment for a new lease, would the dealer charge me 10% on the trade in value?

[tofu1413]

if trade is owned outright, you pay the tax on the trade in value (or scale it back assigned value, tax in) to show as down.

[Funnel]

Originally Posted by yray

not sure if off topic but if I trade in my car at a dealer to use as down payment for a new lease, would the dealer charge me 10% on the trade in value?

If you are leasing your new car and owned outright your old car, you will only get 5% GST reduction. However on the lease agreement both PST and GST are deducted from selling price therefore dealer are required to charge you PST upfront. Usually 7% but if you buy something over $57,000 then you will pay 10% PST upfront.

[dorian]

A couple years back icbc went to my friends house to "confirm" the price he sold his car for.

It was sold below market value. Yes icbc does house calls lol

[nsx042003]

I really wish CBC marketplace do a story on this.