So with mRNA vaccines having around 88% effectiveness against Delta (rather than 99% with typical covid), to reach herd immunity we now need about 97.4% of the population to be vaccinated.
This also means the vaccines that are less than 88% effective against Delta (AZ, Sinovac, maybe J&J?) are impossible to achieve herd immunity.
This is assuming a variant worse than Delta doesn't pop up.
tl;dr: we're fucked.
I assuming that we are definitely going to get additional variants that are worse than delta as there's simply too many people who are unvaxxed and/or we can't get people vaccinated quickly enough to prevent mutations.
Going to be a lot more dead people in the coming years.
hud 91gt
08-24-2021 07:26 PM
Doom and gloom lol. We are already seeing our country is walking a pretty thin line to control this. If it comes down to it, no one is going to have a choice to have a booster or not. The stubbornness of the few left are just going to make it all the more painful.
TORONTO – Clayton Bach, a local man who believes that the Pfizer and Moderna COVID vaccines are incredibly dangerous has demanded you produce a single study showing they are safe, but not that one.
“They rushed the technology. There is simply no proof that these vaccines are safe in the long run. In fact show me one single study that shows the opposite and I’ll go out and get the vaccine right now. One. Single. Study.” Said Bach, followed immediately by “No not that one. That one doesn’t count. Everyone knows the ‘independent research group’ that produced that study is in the pocket of big pharma.”
“Show me another study. Do it. You can’t. No not that one either! Man you google fast.”
Bach, a loose acquaintance you met in University but who appears on your facebook feed more often than your best friend and wife put together, has taken to make outlandish claims about what he will do if a single bit of evidence can be produced that proves him wrong, only to immediately refuse once this is done.
“The vaccines alter your DNA, causing harm to your sperm and giving any kids you have horrible birth defects. And if you can show me a single bit of research that proves otherwise I’ll give you ten thousand dollars,” posted Bach last week. No one had apparently been able to do so, although that may have something to do with Bach deleting every comment on his post.
In related news, an anti-masker comparing mask mandates to Nazi Germany was surprisingly not interested in hearing from Holocaust Survivors on how the two situations are a bit different.
68style
08-24-2021 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by westopher
(Post 9037560)
Why do these fucking idiots think they know something the whole medical field doesn’t about mRNA. Some dipfuck I was talking to the other day was telling me that if pilots get the mRNA they aren’t allowed to fly because it’s too dangerous.
I asked him if he’d like me to call my pilot friend and he declined. I asked anyways and he’s like “no it’s pretty much the opposite. Tell him to shut the fuck up”
Of course the next part of the convo talks about studies that tucker Carlson has showed, etc.
It's exactly the same as arguing with someone religious about whether god exists... just an endless array of whataboutism...
I don't think these people necessarily think they know 'more' than scientists... but they think that they're all working for governments and part of a big conspiracy against society and privacy.
I think the only wakeup call for these cocky fools who grew up not being able to be touched in western society with all their rights, etc is to go somewhere where they laugh in your face when you ask to speak to a lawyer and you can get beat to shit just because a military or police official was in a bad mood and didn't like you and there's not a fucking thing you can do about it. There's tonnes of places in the world where suddenly you're an ant and if a shoe comes down on you that's just tough luck and it's game over... these people don't appreciate or seem to understand that at all. They're literally living in a country with nothing but protection and freedom but they think the opposite because they've got zero understanding of anything outside their own little bubble.
westopher
08-24-2021 08:17 PM
I had that conversation earlier. These cunts talking about being given first dibs on life saving drugs comparing it to the holocaust when they are told they can't go have their fucking chicken fingies at cactus club, while people all of the world deal with whatever it is they are dealing with (no matter what it is, because literally anything is) that is 1000000000x more serious.
On topic, I'll publicly out this guy LOL. Imagine thinking that it's unconstitutional to not be able to go eat at a restaurants or go to a music festival. Fucking clowns man.
Imagine thinking that mandatory vaccines have never been a thing. Wow I wonder how polio got eradicated!!! Must be magic!?
Going to be a lot more dead people in the coming years.
Hmm.... All this talk pre-covid about population sizes dwindling across most of the world, and the need for an autonomous workforce, and now this... Hmmm something something govt plot, nwo, something, something 5G!
I can see why conspiracy theorists think as they do, makes everything a lot more interesting, like you're watching/living in a Sci fi film :lol
Can the US crack down on fake vaccination cards?
By Daniel Thomas
Business reporter, New York
Published10 hours ago
As more people in the US are asked to prove they have been vaccinated in order to work, study or socialise, a flourishing black market in fake vaccination cards has sprung up. But what can be done to tackle it?
The operator behind "Covid19vaccinecardsss" took just seconds to reply. One of a slew of Instagram accounts hawking fake proof of Covid-19 vaccination cards, whoever was running the page was eager to sell, inviting the BBC to move over to an encrypted messaging app to make a deal.
For $100 (£70), the vendor would deliver a "registered" card, with either the logo of the US Centers for Diseases Control and Prevention (CDC) or Britain's National Health Service.
Payment could be made in Apple Pay or Bitcoin and delivery would be "discrete" and within 24 hours, they promised.
"Your cards will be saved into the database system," they told the BBC. "[These are] very good original vaccine cards, no worries."
As the Delta variant of coronavirus sweeps the US, businesses, universities and cities such as New York and San Francisco have introduced vaccine mandates to boost uptake of jabs.
Spoiler!
But vaccine hesitancy remains high and a cottage industry for bogus inoculation cards has emerged to help people get around the rules.
Fakes have been sold on platforms from eBay to Whatsapp and there have been high profile busts, with warnings that counterfeiters and buyers could face jail.
Yet users, authorities and many others are sceptical that the use of false cards can be stopped.
Jennifer is head bartender at the busy Peculiar Pub in Greenwich Village, New York, where customers must show proof of vaccination in order to enter as part of a citywide mandate affecting bars, gyms and other indoor venues.
No one's raised her suspicions yet but she thinks it will be "really hard" to spot fake vaccination documents, which in New York can take the form of a paper card from the health authorities or merely a photo of that card.
"As long as it's printed and you can just write a date, how am I going to know the person that injected you and where you got it? There are hundreds and thousands of vaccination sites in the US, people can come to your home now to give you the vaccine."
Counterfeiters appear to be doing brisk business.
Last week, customs officials in Memphis, Tennessee and Anchorage, Alaska seized 6,000 false vaccination cards in separate shipments from China destined for recipients across the US.
They were printed with the CDC logo and closely resembled the genuine cards given to US citizens when they get vaccinated. However, when officials looked closer they noticed spelling mistakes and poor printing quality.
At the same time, more people who are using false documents are getting caught.
Recently, a Miami couple was arrested for allegedly trying to enter Hawaii using fake cards in breach of the state's travel laws, which require proof of vaccination or a negative test result to avoid quarantine.
Enzo Dalmazzo, 43, and Daniela Dalmazzo, 31, who travelled with their two children, are facing $8,000 (£5,000) in fines - although the maximum penalty could have been jail.
The flourishing market has prompted warnings from the FBI that unauthorised use of a government agency's seal is a crime and violators could face fines or up to five years in prison.
Chuck Schumer, the Democratic Senate majority leader, has called for a federal crackdown and national education campaign to stop counterfeiting. Why, he also asked, were people risking prosecution to get fake vaccine cards when jabs are free and plentiful in the US?
Stacey, who works at another busy Greenwich Village bar, says friends of hers are thinking of buying fake cards because they do not want to get jabbed over fears about vaccine safety.
Resistance to jabs and vaccine mandates is fierce in some parts of the US, where only 60% of the adult population is fully vaccinated, and typically driven by online disinformation and calls to protect civil liberties.
Stacey, who is vaccinated, says her friends think vaccine mandates could stop them doing everyday things if they become more common, and so fake documentation will offer a workaround.
But she adds: "It's worrisome in terms of public health. If they are choosing to come in with a fake vaccination card they are putting themselves at risk to people who are doing the same thing."
Bogus cards are easily available on social media, messaging apps and the dark web where they can be bought for anywhere between $25 (£18) and $500, according to reports.
On Instagram accounts often promote fake cards alongside images featuring anti-vaccination slogans or disinformation about vaccine safety.
Instagram shut down accounts the BBC reported but others remain on its site. Anyone buying, selling, or trading in fake, or genuine, medical documents on its platforms will be barred, the company said.
"We'll continue to identify and remove this content whenever we find it, and will disable accounts, pages or groups that repeatedly break our rules," a spokeswoman told the BBC.
Some New York businesses are concerned they could be held liable if someone is found on their premises with a fake card.
Sean, who manages Off the Wagon, another nightspot in Greenwich Village, thinks all proof-of-vaccination cards should be digital to stop fraud.
Such passes are planned or in use in the UK and Denmark, for example, but the US has no similar scheme.
Several digital vaccine apps are available within New York City, but bars like Sean's still can't access systems to scan them, which worries him.
"I am expecting [fake vaccination cards] just like I expect fake IDs for underage drinking," he tells the BBC. "But there isn't much you can do about the paper ones.
"That's why it is important to know we won't be held liable… We're at the very early stages with all of this, it's a fickle process."
I can see why conspiracy theorists think as they do, makes everything a lot more interesting, like you're watching/living in a Sci fi film :lol
plot twist: passports/QR codes is how their gonna track us :troll:
inv4zn
08-25-2021 08:25 AM
That BBC article is so disheartening.
Fuck we're trying to solve climate change, inequality, conflicts and war - and the real reason society is going to crumble is because of World War Stupid. I hope textbooks in the future (if books even exist lol) will name Facebook as the principal cause of the Age of Stupidity.
The Producer
08-25-2021 08:37 AM
just opened my work email this morning to find 3 cancelled orders for events. hopefully they're only postponed but nobody is taking any chances.
back to survival mode for us and back to record profits for shitty online sales giants.
mikemhg
08-25-2021 04:47 PM
I find it so ironic that the same conservative friends decrying that it's "their body" and that they should have the freedom to choose, are the same one's that don't believe that it is up to the woman's right to "choose" whether or not she can have an abortion.
It's funny how the the pretense of your body, your choice only applies to vaccines :lol
Also, it's been hilarious watching people post photos of Auschwitz, and Star of David armbands, comparing this mandate to the Nazis :lol
Such bad faith ridiculous arguments.
mikemhg
08-25-2021 04:53 PM
Also had my cousin (a restaurant owner), who her and her family are also not vaxed, claiming they will not follow the protocols at their restaurant.
Her argument is literally the following:
"What if you went to a restaurant and asked the waiter that you'd like to confirm what drugs they're taking such as marijuana, cocaine, meth, fentanyl, or if they have any STDs such as HIVs, and Hepatitis."
I told her that's a complete false equivalency, someone’s level of drug usage is not communicable, and neither is an STD in that type of setting. Besides, if you had sex with someone while carrying an STD, and not informing that person of such, you'd be prosecuted.
Where are these people getting this crap?
BlackV62K2
08-25-2021 05:11 PM
Was out eating and over heard a conversation these guys were having where one guy was saying to the other "I was going to get my shot but now they are forcing me to do it with the vaccine passport to do stuff, fuck them, I'm not getting it anymore". Typical manlet looking douche that probably injected one too many steroids. Ffs
Hondaracer
08-25-2021 05:21 PM
I had a customer at work that brought up vaccines and he got his first shot but wasn’t going to get his second because he felt “weaker” after the first..
SkinnyPupp
08-25-2021 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackV62K2
(Post 9037627)
Was out eating and over heard a conversation these guys were having where one guy was saying to the other "I was going to get my shot but now they are forcing me to do it with the vaccine passport to do stuff, fuck them, I'm not getting it anymore". Typical manlet looking douche that probably injected one too steroids. Ffs
That exact argument is something that has been floating around social media. I've seen it on at least 2 different platforms. FailFish
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikemhg
(Post 9037624)
Also had my cousin (a restaurant owner), who her and her family are also not vaxed, claiming they will not follow the protocols at their restaurant.
Her argument is literally the following:
"What if you went to a restaurant and asked the waiter that you'd like to confirm what drugs they're taking such as marijuana, cocaine, meth, fentanyl, or if they have any STDs such as HIVs, and Hepatitis."
I told her that's a complete false equivalency, someone’s level of drug usage is not communicable, and neither is an STD in that type of setting. Besides, if you had sex with someone while carrying an STD, and not informing that person of such, you'd be prosecuted.
Vaccines don't fuck with fertility, but covid does
Vansterdam
08-25-2021 06:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaracer
(Post 9037631)
I had a customer at work that brought up vaccines and he got his first shot but wasn’t going to get his second because he felt “weaker” after the first..
who knows maybe eventually they gonna require at least 3 or more shots for you to go anywhere, just like how they expect everyone to have both by October :concentrate:
