coronavirus discussion

[westopher]

Originally Posted by white rocket

But can't you still carry and pass on the 'Rona even if you are vaccinated? The poke is only to boost your own immune system to fight it off if you get it? So you're not taking up a hospital bed right?

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the hate from vaxxed people towards the unvaccinated. Won't the unvaxxed just eventually die off? Isn't the vax like a shield and the 'Rona is a sword slashing through life. It hits you, you have a shield which will minimize or prevent damage. It hits an unshielded person, bam, mega injury, maybe a fatality. Is that how it works? If that's the case, are unvaxxed people continuing to spread it around worse than the vaccinated who can still spread it around? Is that where the hate comes from? Are the unvaxxed keeping the 'Rona around to where it's "breaking through" to triple and even quadruple poked humans? Will it take a 100% worldwide vaxxed population with a shot every 6 months to make everyone feel safe again?

I assure you that even though it may seem like I am coming across as smug and snarky, which I am, I do still have questions like the above and a lot of it just doesn't make sense to me. I have unvaxxed people in my life, science believing logical thinking people, help me hate them more.

As long as unvaccinated people are taking up hospital beds causing things like cancer treatments to get delayed for a member of my family, yeah I’ll continue to hate them.
You don’t believe in what doctors, scientists and other members of the medical community say will keep you safe, that’s fine, but stay the fuck out of the way of the people that need treatment for illnesses that they need treatment for. I’d say the same thing if the cancer patient was offered a needle that would have a massive chance of protecting them was refused because “never trust big pharma bro” was their mentality.

[Blueboy222]

[JDMDreams]

Time to defund vpd and put in RCMP they can be the greenest unvaccinated city on the world.

[white rocket]

Thanks for the responses everyone.

I can see why westopher has his opinion and it shows that real world first hand context will form it. Sorry you're going through that bro. I personally like the pro-choice vibe and shun the fear mongering bs media stories that change constantly and come off suspect but if that was my mom waiting for surgery and I was being told that a non-vaccinated covid-infected human was occupying her bed I'd be fucking livid; and also have a completely different view. Perspective is everything.

JDMDreams, you also have a super rigid view, which I completely respect because everyone is entitled to their own, but I'm curious how you got there. Curious where that level of fear and/or annoyance of the unvaccinated came from. I feel like you even got a bit triggered because maybe you felt that I singled you out and your response even told me that I better be careful around the unvaccinated. Like you are trying to push your own fear on me. That's kinda interesting to me. Curious the logic behind that. I certainly didn't mean any disrespect and only singled you out due to your strong opinion and because of my complete curiosity of it. Do you work in an area that has COVID affecting you in a negative way directly? Or has a family member been affected?

I'm not here asking possible snarky questions to change anyones opinion or peddle my own; more trying to understand how people form theirs and what events, if any, lead up to it.

[westopher]

I know you’re just in it for perspective and not picking a fight here. I truly don’t mind what people do, as long as there’s no negative effect on others. I’d never dream of butting in on who someone can (consensually) have a relationship with, what religion they practice (even personally having no interest in religion) or what a woman can do with their body.
What we have here is definitive evidence that refusing vaccination has negative effects on those around them. As for the argument that vaccinated people spread covid as easily as unvaccinated people, I welcome a peer reviewed study to be posted here that confirms that, because as far as I can see, that’s just made up.
If you are a vaccinated person with covid, even if it spreads to someone just as easily, being vaccinated, you are less likely to get it, and you can’t spread what you didn’t catch.

[StylinRed]

Originally Posted by inv4zn

So, you mean, like, they are lower?

Literally every credible source out there saying statistically vaccinated are far likely to have 1) less chance of infection at all, 2) less severe symptoms if infected, 3) reduced transmission, 4) better immunity than 'natural'.

But still we have morons (not you, personally) spewing 'No hur durr let me pick and choose information from random sources on a topic I understand nothing about so I can protect my freedum!'

Yeah it went from, no load, to far less load, and now to almost the same load (or the same load depending on the study)

my original point was that pro-vaxxers (regular joes not the scientists/doctors) don't really know what's going on either, due to ignorance or ever changing conditions, but to allay their own fears they'll attack anti-vaxxers with facts that may not be facts, or even with facts that no longer hold as much weight as they think

Not saying being pro vax is wrong, but we can ease up on those who don't want to be vaxxed for whatever reason they have.

I'm sure not all anti-vaxxers are 5G lizard ppl flat earther conspiracists assholes walking around mask less demanding their freedom allows them to act like a dick

[JDMDreams]

My experience basically comes from being having to deal with both vaxed and unvaxed since day one. Well basically everyone was unvaxed since day one . Let's just say I'm essential service and I did not have the luxury to sit at home and collect cerb to day trade. I had to risk my life, family's well being to do a job to service the general public. From all walks of life. From day zero. Before there were masks, mask mandates, or even vaccines, so you had the fear of getting sick just from trying to do your job everyday so I can be a $14 dolla balla.

I would say by now 90% of the people I see on a daily basis is pretty good with at least masking up in a public place. You still have 10% of the dumbasses who say they have exemptions, refuse to wear a mask or say it's fake. So my work basically still has to find a way to service these entitled people without turning them away. This is mainly where the frustration comes in as everyone else who follows the rules wonder why we bend over backwards and give special treatment to these unmasked unvaxed. They basically always stir up trouble plus it makes us look like we don't take health and safety seriously.

Imagine having some loud mouth 30 year old making a scene about masks, getting aggressive 6 feet next to a 80 year old masked up grandma in a public setting while trying to be professional and can't legally drag them out.

So I guess you can say it's fatigue. We finally have the miracle cure yet these people still say coronas ain't real. We'll never be able to get out of this unless everyone is vaxed. They've done nothing but hold society back as a whole. I guess I see it as a sign of respect. With the vaccine. To protect not only yourself but others. And that you're not some selfish individual that only thinks about their own beliefs. Of course I don't want to get random shots, but billions of people has gotten the shot and if it keeps me healthy and not die why not.

And yes I would be pissed if some unvaxed person came to a group event without telling everyone. It's disrespect. Like telling the person you might have aids after you fuck them.
Like a good old church gathering without masks singing and no distancing.

[CRS]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

Like I said that's what was assumed originally, but no longer, especially with delta

https://www.ucdavis.edu/health/covid...cinated-people

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/art...evels-of-virus

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/s...d-delta-easily

Mind you the load is still lower than unvaxxed individuals but not as much as it was before the variants

This study did not directly address how easily vaccinated people can get infected with SARS-CoV-2, or how readily someone with a breakthrough infection can transmit the virus.

“Our study does not provide information on infectiousness,” Michelmore said. “Transmission will be influenced by several factors, not just vaccination status and viral load.”

From the first ucdavis article

We don’t yet know how much transmission can happen from people who get COVID-19 after being vaccinated

From the second article

I got pay walled before being able to fully read the third article.

We're talking abut transmissibility. Viral loads will vary but that is only one factor in determining how infectious it is.

[JDMDreams]

On a side note, I thought about this today. Due to the popularity of Squid games, we can do something called Corona games and put it on Netflix Amazon prime. We can maybe do some beyond scared straight prison style reality show where we follow the unvaxed infected. Follow the day in the life and make sure we show real death scenes when they die. Maybe if they survive they win like $100k cash prize. I'd sure pay to watch this and maybe more people will believe it's real and convince people to get vaxed.

[donk.]

Then someone can make a corona coin, and rugpull 15mil

[SkinnyPupp]

Originally Posted by CRS

From the first ucdavis article



From the second article

I got pay walled before being able to fully read the third article.

We're talking abut transmissibility. Viral loads will vary but that is only one factor in determining how infectious it is.

Important to keep this stuff in mind when reading articles about very early studies.

Of course everything is very early still

Bottom line is there seems to be a ton of reasons to get vaccinated, and almost zero reasons not to. Zero known reasons for most people without specific issues.

So... just do it and help the world recover?

[underscore]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

Not saying being pro vax is wrong, but we can ease up on those who don't want to be vaxxed for whatever reason they have.

If they're the ones staying at home or at least masking up, minimizing contact, etc and stick to their guns and stay home if they get sick I doubt most people have much issue with them. But the fuckwits who refuse to wear masks, protest outside medical facilities, spread bullshit and lies everywhere, but then go clog up a hospital bed when their worthless ass gets sick? No. Their selfish cunt behaviour is getting other people killed so they can go fuck themselves with a cactus.

[Hondaracer]

Be scared!!!



The bad drug crisis has killed 3/4 of the 2 year total Covid deaths in the last 11 months. Effecting almost strictly people aged 19-39. No one cares about that though.

[whitev70r]

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

Be scared!!!


The bad drug crisis has killed 3/4 of the 2 year total Covid deaths in the last 11 months. Effecting almost strictly people aged 19-39. No one cares about that though.

Yah, I heard it was the highest month for overdose deaths ... ~ 200. It's tough ... if you've ever worked with those on the streets - addiction, mental health, etc. While we all agree that every life is valuable and worth saving ... in reality, we as a society, act with a priority list.

[punkwax]

There are plenty of people who care. If you could get addicted to drugs if an addict sneezed near you, I’d imagine that would get plenty of media coverage

[CivicBlues]

Drug overdoses aren't contagious or clog up Hospitals to the point other people can't use them

[Great68]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

Drug overdoses aren't contagious or clog up Hospitals to the point other people can't use them

Yeah exactly. The anti-vaxxers are still impacting the health of others in other ways, like taking hospital space leading to delays in treatment of others.

So selfish and totally preventable.

[Teriyaki]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

Drug overdoses aren't contagious or clog up Hospitals to the point other people can't use them

Drug overdoses absolutely can clog up the hospitals. To the extent that unvaccinated people are using the beds etc? No because they're not as long term. They can and do strain the system though. Just the constant cry from paramedics and the ambulance service for not being able to respond to the drug overdoses should be evidence enough. That means the ambulance system is stuck being deployed on this particular subset of users, and someone's grandma that had a fall down the stairs is getting delayed response or worse no response. Feel that this is a discussion better left for the downtowneastside thread or something, we had one of those right?

[320icar]

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

The bad drug crisis has killed 3/4 of the 2 year total Covid deaths in the last 11 months. Effecting almost strictly people aged 19-39. No one cares about that though.

You’re right. So why do you keep bringing it up? My level of care between drug addicts on the DTES, and literally *anyone* who can get covid and die through no fault of their own is at the same level as the probability of dying from covid; almost zero

[Hondaracer]

Grandma shitting her pants in a care home dieing from Covid over young people (many from no fault of their own) are addicted to lethal drugs and dieing at a rate twice of Covid. People who had their whole lives ahead of them VS the 80+ year olds dying, yea ok.

Of course it clogs up the entire system you don’t think the “burn out” of paramedics etc mentioned above is largely due to the drug crisis compared to the occasional person they have to deal with with Covid? Lol

You have to understand, drug addicts and the people involved in this crisis aren’t just the DTES people. These are normal people living lives hidden from others and dieing in their homes etc.

[westopher]

The overdose crisis has absolutely decimated the ambulance operations in BC.
Certain people don’t care. But lots do. The unfortunate part is the pushback from the public for things like clean drug supply and other solutions that they don’t like because they feel like addicts inconvenience them. Before my wife worked in labour and delivery she was in medicine at St. Paul’s.
The issue they had was people would OD, spend time in the ER, then move to medicine. People would ask for help to get clean, but then the waiting list for programs would be several months away to actually enter an addictions program. The only option, because you can’t keep a “healthy” person in the hospital for several months, they would have to go “home” whether it was actually a home or the DTES and use up until the time a spot became available, often either dying, or becoming so entrenched back in their drug use they wouldn’t bother going into the treatment.
It’s a fucking joke that we could pay people 2k a month to stay home, even people who didn’t even come close to making 2k a month, but we somehow don’t have the funds to allocate to addictions counselling when we are in this crisis. Again, it’s cause you can’t catch a heroin overdose.
Do I care more about someone dying because someone coughed near them? Honestly, I probably do, but I definitely believe people with addictions issues deserve 100 fold better treatment options.

[JDMDreams]

You don't choose to catch covid covid chooses you. Drugs on the other hand just doesn't jump inside you.

But drugs are like any thing else ppl get addicted to, drinking, smoking, gambling. It's a decision that was made. Just have to face the consequences.

Are we gonna hand out "clean" tar chemical free cigarettes and booze so these ppl can slowly get clean. Not on my tax dollars. How about we give out free money to the gamblers too then so there's less crime.

And how come no one said anything regarding the vpd. What have they accomplished, decriminalised drugs so they can give more vis? Join the anti vaccine protests?

[Hondaracer]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

Drug overdoses aren't contagious or clog up Hospitals to the point other people can't use them

So hold on.. 200 people a month DYING from drugs..almost as many as total Covid patients in hospital

Based on 200 people dying, how many who OD etc. and are resuscitated are brought into hospital? Three, five, TEN times as many?

That doesn’t clog up the hospital? Come on.

[Hondaracer]

Originally Posted by JDMDreams

You don't choose to catch covid covid chooses you. Drugs on the other hand just doesn't jump inside you.

But drugs are like any thing else ppl get addicted to, drinking, smoking, gambling. It's a decision that was made. Just have to face the consequences.

Are we gonna hand out "clean" tar chemical free cigarettes and booze so these ppl can slowly get clean. Not on my tax dollars. How about we give out free money to the gamblers too then so there's less crime.

And how come no one said anything regarding the vpd. What have they accomplished, decriminalised drugs so they can give more vis? Join the anti vaccine protests?

You’re an idiot.

[68style]

I’m so used to reading “Your an idiot” online I actually almost thought you wrote it wrong