Friend just told me he has been having suicidal thoughts. What do I do?

[PeanutButter]

Hey RS,

One of my friends just told me and another buddy that he's been having suicidal thoughts. He said he's been fighting demons almost every day and he's super f*cked up right now, it's been like this since covid, he got married during covid and has a one year old kid. His family life isn't good, work is stressful, doesn't own a house, can't afford a house, doesn't have assets, he feels defeated.

He said he's reached out to a suicide clinic and they gave him strategies, but he doesn't know if it's working.

He's super emotional about things. We had an event and he left early because he said people were making fun of him. Our group busts balls, we've been busting balls since highschool so that's not out of the ordinary for us to talk shit to each other, but he said because there were people there he didn't know he got upset because he felt like the new people would think he's weak or soft. To be honest, I'm trying to think of what some of the guys said to him, but it seemed relatively tame if you ask me. Anyway, that's why he told us about his suicidal thoughts and his situation.

My buddy and I are definitely not qualified to speak to someone about suicide and i'm just wondering if any of you had a similar experience and if you had advice on what we should be doing. My buddy and I are not very empathetic people, so we're worried that we won't handle the situation properly.

Any advice is appreciated. Thanks

[spoon.ek9]

He should talk to a healthcare professional. If you really think he's at risk of harming himself, bring him to an emergency room to be seen. As long as he's willing to seek help, it's likely the best first step he can take. It may end up saving his life. Hope he can sort things out, it's tough out there.

[Badhobz]

Yikes. i would say at least hes reaching out, a good sign. Not sure what the proper procedure here but yes, get professionals involved.

[Liquid_o2]

Went through something similar in 2021/2022. Effects of Covid and an early mid-life crisis sent me into a really dark place.

Glad to hear he is reaching out. As a friend, honestly just go for a beer or lunch or whatever and just hang out and let him speak. Knowing that you have people there for you and willing to listen is huge. You don't have to have definitive answers for him.

What worked for me? Counseling and SSRI's. Didn't think SSRI's would work for me, but holy shit, night and day difference. They allow me to process stressful things like a normal person. Been on them for about 1.5 years now. The counseling helped me control the spiraling to a degree. When you are depressed, everyday things feel stressful.

[Oscar_Binswood]

If he's open to seeking help that's a good sign and there are resources available. The Charles Barham Pavilion located behind Surrey Memorial Hospital specifically deals with mental health and substance abuse. Kind of fits his criteria where he requires urgent but not emergency type of care. (At least from how I interpret his situation) They'll do an intake/assessment and be able to either provide a succession plan moving forward or alternatively refer him elsewhere that may be more suitable to deal with his situation.

Continue to be the open ear for him to talk to. It's not easy sharing these thoughts, and it usually comes with some pretty intense emotions. If his home life is shit, he's likely to have minimal or no support at all. It also allows you to keep tabs on whether he's declining or progressing, and to intervene if he starts deviating quickly down the wrong path.

If it does get to that point, depending on where he lives, a few police departments have a joint partnership with the health authority where a psych nurse rides with a police officer. They typically only respond to check well being, mental health, and outreach types of calls. The nurse would be able to make an assessment on the spot and determine if an emergency apprehension is required, or just further follow ups/referrals/check ins. This program is commonly referred to as Car 67/Car 87.

Best of luck, unfortunately with mental health injuries there isn't a substantive fix and usually requires a lot of trial and error, and time before finding the right fit that each individual is receptive to.

[PeanutButter]

Originally Posted by Liquid_o2

Went through something similar in 2021/2022. Effects of Covid and an early mid-life crisis sent me into a really dark place.

Glad to hear he is reaching out. As a friend, honestly just go for a beer or lunch or whatever and just hang out and let him speak. Knowing that you have people there for you and willing to listen is huge. You don't have to have definitive answers for him.

What worked for me? Counseling and SSRI's. Didn't think SSRI's would work for me, but holy shit, night and day difference. They allow me to process stressful things like a normal person. Been on them for about 1.5 years now. The counseling helped me control the spiraling to a degree. When you are depressed, everyday things feel stressful.

Thanks for this and i'm glad you are on a better path.

The thing about going out with him is what is the procedure. Are we supposed to ask him questions about how he's feeling, or do we just go there to talk about random shit like football like we usually do. I'm just not sure what we should be focusing on conversation wise.

My first instinct is to try to "fix him and his problems", but i'm suspecting we definitely shouldn't do that. We just don't know how to hang out with him anymore now that we know what's going on.

Did you just find a counsellor yourself or did you go through the suicide hotline. He said he talked to the suicide hotline, but I think making sure he's talking to a counsellor is a must and i'll see if he's on any medication right now.

The other thing that may be affecting his emotional state is he's drinking a lot more now. He only ever drank during parties, but now he's drinking daily and pretty heavy sometimes, so there's a lot going on.

[EvoFire]

I went through a dark time about a decade ago, under similar type of pressures (relationship, financial, and stress). I contemplated suicide as well. It wasn't death that scared me but rather I didn't want to scar other's around me that stopped me. Also I didn't want to make a big mess - my first and only serious suicidal thought was while cooking and I had a 12" chef's knife. What went through my mind was how quickly it would be over.

It is a hard one to fight. The finance one cascades very quickly and it's a hard one to solve because only he can help himself ultimately by fixing the root of the problem. I don't have a solution for you but rather to outline what happened in my head to cause me to back into a wall.

I wasn't making enough money, which in itself wasn't a huge problem if I lived at home, but I moved out with my gf
Probably parallel to him not making enough money, which would have been ok but he has a kid now and has more bills to pay + inflation.

Which leads to the need to tightening the belt and trying to save money. For me it meant I couldn't do things that I enjoyed - Going out for a drive whenever I wanted cause gas was expensive. I can't buy what snacks or food I wanted because, guess what, money is tight. And if I did, it would just make me feel guilty that I was wasting money. It's all the little things in life sometimes that makes sure you aren't stuck in a hole, or even when you are, helps lift you up momentarily.
I don't know if he has this particular problem but once you subtract the little things you enjoy, life because bland. You can try and help by taking him out for a beer or whatever, but depending on his personality it may or may not help as he might end up feeling like he owes you and won't come out anymore.

I stopped seeing friends because I couldn't afford it. Which goes back to the last point.


In terms of work - I was stuck in a shitty place dealing with shitty people. I hated them and they didn't like me but none of us could change anything about it, we were all stuck at that shit hole.

I had been looking for a new job but after about 100 applications and a dozen interviews nothing happened.


In terms of relationship, we weren't doing so great as we came off a rough year and were trying to make things work. Some of the problems we had stemmed from my financial tightness and disagreement on some of our life goals. She wanted to buy a home, I didn't want to and was happy renting for the time being.


Ultimately everything went away as I finally landed a new job with a 66% pay bump, WAY better working conditions, less commute cost and stress. All of a sudden the work and financial problems went away overnight. Without the finance stress and the cloud looming, relationship was a lot better as well.


We have two kids right now. The second kid is 8 months old and at times it's challenging. Having kids is challenging for a relationship and intimacy. That's not a problem that's easily solved unless someone can be like "let me look after your kid one night every two weeks so they can go out" kind of deal.
I guess what I am saying is, instead of coping strategies, figure out the root problems and tackle the easiest ones or big impact ones first to try and reduce the load on himself.


/end rambling.

[Badhobz]

jesus. thats some dark ass shit, not even dark0821 kinda dark either.

[Traum]

Given the circumstances, it really is a difficult one.

Eons ago when I was going through a really dark period, my two best buds would regularly check on me and drag me out to do things, even though I wouldn't want to. In hindsight, knowing that there are people who were always there for me unconditionally brought a lot of stability back into my life.

On the other hand, the period took place for me during my university years, and that meant life was much simpler back then -- the lack of money and stress from school are similar but easier versions of what your friend is facing now, and of course the difference in availability of free time for anything is night and day.

Others have already commented on the importance of seeking professional help, and that is exactly what I would recommend as well. But in addition to that, I think the next best thing a friend can do is to regularly check on your friend just to make sure that:

1) he is OK
2) he knows you've got his back
3) he knows that he is important to you

It can be just hanging out, shooting the shxt, grabbing a meal or a beer together, or if you're good with kids, have him bring the little kiddo out so that his partner can catch a breather to relieve some stress as well. If he needs to talk / vent, just let him do most of the talking, while acknowledging his difficulties and the stress he is facing. The absolute worst thing you can do is to bring him out and make him feel like you're just brushing off his complaints.

Doing that will require you to be a good friend, and a better friend than you normally would have been, but your friend trusts you enough to share his suicidal thoughts with you, so now would also be the time for you to step up your game and be there for him.

The dad life gradually gets easier as the kid grows up, and the 1st year is absolutely the most difficult to adjust.

As men, our automatic instinct is to find the source of the problem and try to fix that. But in a lot of cases with emotional / psychological issues and stress, you can't directly just "fix the problem". Letting the emotions and frustrations vent out are equally important.

[murd0c]

sadly this is very common these days with the grim outlook in life and everyone getting financially tightened with the cost of everything going up.

Good on your friend reaching out for help, you guys much be really close and he must really trust you to actually admit these thoughts he has.

If I were you I would call the suicide hotline and as them for advice, they will be able to give you all the resources which you can speak to your friend about and can even go with him to help support him since it is such a difficult thing to do.

The most important thing is getting on this ASAP since hopefully this isn't his last resort and him doing something stupid you could live with the rest of your life thinking you could of prevented (sorry I know its harsh but I would so blame myself if one of my friends told me and did something to themselves)

In the end all you can do is be a good friends and be there for him and try to help him, I'm not sure how close you are with his wife or even parents but maybe speak with them. He might hate you for doing something like that but if that saves his life tha'ts all that matters and once he gets the help he needs he will thank you for that.

[Hondaracer]

Not sure what his employment is like, but to EvoFires point, if he works in an industry or is trained in a way where he may be able to find a better job, better income, etc. I think it may be worthwhile to suggest perhaps looking for another job or somthing that may be a latteral move but ends in being happier overall.

I worked at the same company for 9 years or so and experience a similar decline in my experience there, relationships with co-workers, and looking back it probably effected my mental well-being as well just because I felt like I had to physically drag my ass to work everyday. I eventually discussed being laid off with the owner of the company so that I could deal with some stuff while having that EI safety blanket.

Fast forward to my EI running out and having to look for a new job, when I eventually did get hired I was scared of this new employment and going through the whole process etc.

However, shortly after I realized it wasn’t nearly as big of a deal I had made it out to be. And since I’ve changed jobs again with very little stress experienced.

Could be something to gently guide your friend into in that they may be able to adjust their work/life balance and while it may be a scary proposition, it could be very fruitful in many aspects of their life.

[CivicBlues]

If you guys do go the route of taking him out for drinks make sure he gets home safe. i.e. Drive him home or get him in an taxi/Uber.

I have a sneaking suspicion this epidemic of 18-50 year old men going 'missing' in Vancouver are just suicides many of whom are opportunistic after a night out drinking and being alone at night in a city with a ton of bridges.

Good luck.

[bcrdukes]

I recommend suggesting to your friend to see his family doctor first and to seek help. Offer to take the time out of your day to go with him at the very least and go from there.

While we can all speculate and be Internet armchair psychiatrists, the best thing you can do is be supportive of him and point him in the right direction to seek help from a medical professional. I hope he knows he's lucky to have a friend like you. Good luck.

[hud 91gt]

Next time he comes and is sounded desperate, ask if he knows how he would do it. It’s a good indicator to see how serious in thought they have been and how quickly you need to intervene.

I may have it wrong, but it’s the first thing my wife asks, and she seems to get a lot of these calls.

[68style]

I recommend not drinking, in my darkest times the worst thoughts always came out on the comedown after being home from drinking even if the actual time out was super fun and engaging.

[SSM_DC5]

Most of what I have to suggest is already mentioned, so to reinforce things.

1. If he has a suicidal thoughts. Do not be afraid to ask straight up "are you having suicidal thoughts or thoughts of harming yourself." if the answer is yes "do you have a plan?" at this point you need to assess for yourself how plausible his plan is. For example, he's sitting in Vancouver with the plan to jump off the Eiffel tower... Well it ain't going happen unless he fly's there first. An example that is much more serious is, he regularly takes the bus home and then he says I'm going to jump in front of the bus on my way home. If his plan is very plausible, and you immediately take him to emergency or call 911. There, he will be assessed and potentially be forced to stay in the hospital for a certain period of time.
2. Be vocal that if there are any suicidal thoughts or thoughts of harming himself, he can call you, no matter the time of day.
3. Going drinking isn't a good idea as alcohol is a depressant. And if he is taking meds, decreases efficacy.
4. Don't know the specific resources to help him get help, but keep looking as the solution may very well be taking some meds to make things good again. The meds will be trial and error, so you'll want to continue checking in on him and not think that all is good after his first visit to a professional.

[Liquid_o2]

Originally Posted by PeanutButter

Thanks for this and i'm glad you are on a better path.

The thing about going out with him is what is the procedure. Are we supposed to ask him questions about how he's feeling, or do we just go there to talk about random shit like football like we usually do. I'm just not sure what we should be focusing on conversation wise.

My first instinct is to try to "fix him and his problems", but i'm suspecting we definitely shouldn't do that. We just don't know how to hang out with him anymore now that we know what's going on.

Did you just find a counsellor yourself or did you go through the suicide hotline. He said he talked to the suicide hotline, but I think making sure he's talking to a counsellor is a must and i'll see if he's on any medication right now.

The other thing that may be affecting his emotional state is he's drinking a lot more now. He only ever drank during parties, but now he's drinking daily and pretty heavy sometimes, so there's a lot going on.

When you go out with him, just be relaxed and don't probe too much unless he brings stuff up. Talk about life, talk about football, keep it light. DON'T try and fix things. No matter what you say, it won't fix his depression. People tried to do this for me and it just made me angrier because they didn't understand what I was really going through. "Nobody understands" when you are going through depression. You feel like there is no hope and no way to get out.

When I was at my lowest point, I would go out with a guy from my rec sports team on weeknights and it turned out he also dealt with depression from time to time. Not as bad as I was going through - but it sure helped talk to someone who had similar thoughts sometimes.

I talked with a few counselors until I found one I liked. You can do 15 min intro meetings with them for free. SSRI's take minimum one to two months to start to feel the effects, so you have to stick with them for a while to see if they work.

He has to stop drinking. I went from drinking three nights a week to one beer a week. Alcohol is a major depressant.

Every person is different in terms of how they deal with their depression. It took me 18 months to get back to my "normal". He has to try a bunch of stuff and see what sticks. Stuff that I tried:

- Counseling (worked)
- SSRI (worked)
- Natural supplements (didn't work)
- Increasing activity/running (quasi-worked)
- Breathing exercises (didn't work for me no matter which app I used)
- Books on depression (didn't work)
- Opening up to friends (worked)
- Taking a leave from work (worked)
- Daily Journal (may have worked, but was too depressed to keep it going)

[whitev70r]

Yah, one thing I've also tried is to introduce person going through depression to another who has gone through similar situation ... they understand each other like no one else (unless you yourself have been there). Exactly what Liquid_o2, EvoFire (and others here) did, just tell personal stories, share what worked and what didn't. The subtle message when you do that is that you're not alone nor the only one in this. There is hope.

[EvoFire]

To help you try and understand and relate if you've never gone through it. hyperbole and a half had a really good miniseries on depression

Hyperbole and a Half: Adventures in Depression

Hyperbole and a Half: Depression Part Two

I read them while I was battling it without realizing it, and it put me into the right frame of mind to face it properly and identify that it was depression I was dealing with. I hope it would help you understand a bit what they are going through.

Side note: Hyperbole and a half was AMAZING. I loved every moment of it.

[SiRV]

Not official medical advice, but i suggest switching out alcohol for marijuana - less depressant effects and safer overall. If you guys are into drugs/psychedelics, would he worthwhile going for a mushroom “trip” while he feels emotionally more stable - I’ve seen/heard anecdotes of this working.

I went through something similar last year after a close family death. I found a series of these podcasts very grounding and helpful too.

https://youtu.be/LTGGyQS1fZE?si=KDb7Qh-wFS08QJeJ

[MG1]

Find out from his family and other friends what he's good at. Get him to help others out. Helping others in need gives a person a reason or better yet, a sense of self worth. Nothing better feeling than helping others solve issues. All of a sudden, you see others and their struggles in a different light. Get him to volunteer?

my two bits.