Income Disparity Amoung Your Friends?

[supafamous]

I can't believe you Richmond boys aren't getting your fried chicken from LA Chicken. The shame.

[Badhobz]

Yeah I had a good buddy of mine ask to borrow like 75,000. He wanted it for a down payment on his house but I just didn’t feel right to lend him that kinda money. After that episode we drifted apart. A real shame, but honestly i just couldn’t imagine how he would have paid me back on a teachers salary

I still feel guilty today that I prioritized money over friendship but I think it was the right move. If he couldn’t pay it back or had issues it would have ruined the friendship too.

[winson604]

I have many groups of friends but it's really the core 3 all of which are different.

1st group consists of 2 buddies who I've known since Grade 1 and rest once we started HS. Everyone in this group works but nobody has a significantly crazier job than the next. One guy in the group it's known his family has coin, owns a bunch of residential and commercial properties but since we've met him in HS he has never been defined by it nor has it been blatantly obvious his family has coin i.e. he isn't showing up to school in a Ferrari' and flaunting his shit. In this group nobody are cheap skates but things have always been handled as we all just pay our share. Even though almost everyone is Chinese a culture where it's very normal for somebody rich or not to just randomly pick up the tab it doesn't really happen in this group and it's all good nobody cares. Even though we could afford "nice" dinners our hangouts act out the same they did when we were 13. Grab bottles of whiskies, weed, and coke and go to a random park and have fun. We may start or end at somebodies house and a meal may just be fast food or some modest restaurant.

2nd group knows the first group and sometimes the 2 groups will join but most of the time this group operates separately. All Chinese group with a mix of CBCs and Hongers. It's just simply known the Hongers have money but none of them look down on the working class in the group. Hangouts are always the same, go to the usual hosts house and drinks bottles and bottles of whiskey while they cook or order some feast. We only go out for dinner when it's somebody's birthday. Pretty usual get a private room at a Chinese restaurant nothing even the poorest person in the group can't handle when you split the bill. Nobody gives a shit who has how much money and in this group the unwritten rule is if we need to talk about money then we can't be friends. The host for example is always the host and while other people do bring bottles he'll often just open what he has on average like $300 bottles up to $1000 and nothing needs to be said about hey I'll chip in this or that.

3rd group is with an older crowd. I'm 40 and the rest are in their 50's and rich. Not like flying private jets ballin but all own and can buy houses on the West side of Vancouver so rich enough. Dinners out and about at some fancy place the norm. Average bill $300-$500 a head (they usually pay). That said, these people don't look down on me and treat me like some charity case. They're respectful, don't flaunt their wealth in front of my face and are just genuinely good people.

[Hondaracer]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

Yeah I had a good buddy of mine ask to borrow like 75,000. He wanted it for a down payment on his house but I just didn’t feel right to lend him that kinda money. After that episode we drifted apart. A real shame, but honestly i just couldn’t imagine how he would have paid me back on a teachers salary

I still feel guilty today that I prioritized money over friendship but I think it was the right move. If he couldn’t pay it back or had issues it would have ruined the friendship too.

No one should be asking any “friend” to borrow money period imo.

Unless it’s the most dire of straights, it never ends positively. And frankly even just asking to borrow money feels yucky.

I’ve bought plane tickets for friends before so we could attend bachelor parties etc. because I knew they were hard up. But I made it blatantly clear up front, you don’t owe me anything, you never have to pay me back, and I’ll never say anything to anyone about this. Felt good helping out but I’d never just lend someone cash.

[hud 91gt]

If a true friend was in need of money, I’d give it to him in my mind. If it gets returned it’s a bonus. I keep a small group of friends, but they are all good friends. If it came to a point they actually asked, they really do need it.

Going out with buds? Man, I don’t know the last time I went out with dudes where it was more then $20 for food. Shawarma, cinnamon buns, pizza. The only time I go to a real restaurant is with my wife. Lol.

[bcrdukes]

Everyone who posts in this thread gets a thank!

[winson604]

I think the last time me or any friend has outright asked to borrow money was back in Grade 8 or 9. Sometimes somebody will spot first but that isn't the same usually it just originates from a single person grabbing something first. I have a huge pet peeve with owing people money and will always pay my share back instantly if possible or asap. If the role was reversed I'll never ask or remind people hey you didn't pay your share back yet though it hasn't ever really been a problem. Yea some people are a little slower but it isn't due to them trying to dodge their share.

[sonick]

I wouldn't sweat it much, so many discussions on here end up being a low key dick measuring contest between members anyway.

Just look at that How much does your Vacation cost thread. Quickly became comparing how many days vacation each person had, even though it didn't even ask about it in the first place.

Take it all with a grain of salt and enjoy. Preferably with a Domino's or Mcdouble.

[EvoFire]

I don't think hanging out at a restaurant is all that anyways after covid. You aren't getting much chatting done if there's more than 8 ppl in a fancy restaurant, and which I agree sometimes ends up being a dick measuring contest. The cheaper the food the better the fun.

The good hang outs are actually heading to some one's house, do a BBQ or just late night grab some snacks and some beers or wine. I've covered the BBQ at our place for the last 2 years. If we went out it would cost us $100 for the two of us, that $100 is typically enough to cover BBQ food for at least 4-6 ppl and have ppl bring your own booze.

[PeanutButter]

Well, the one friend who owes everyone money is a friend from grade school and we've all been friends for so long. So it feels difficult to just cut him out of our lives. He is incredibly loyal, but he's bad with money. I've learned that if you're going to lend someone money, don't expect it back from them.

I guess I feel a sense of guilt for some reason. Like, I'm living this perfect life. It's like what did I do to deserve the life I'm living? I have my own place, I have a beautiful family and a healthy relationship with my spouse, and I can go on multiple vacations a year and I religiously put money away for my retirement.

As time goes on, I have multiple friends who are going to be f*cked as they will likely still have debt, they'll have nothing saved, and when they're 70 years old, you can't live pay cheque to pay cheque because you likely can't work at the same level anymore.

[PeanutButter]

Originally Posted by sonick

I wouldn't sweat it much, so many discussions on here end up being a low key dick measuring contest between members anyway.

Just look at that How much does your Vacation cost thread. Quickly became comparing how many days vacation each person had, even though it didn't even ask about it in the first place.

Take it all with a grain of salt and enjoy. Preferably with a Domino's or Mcdouble.

I think this is my favourite part of this forum. When I see members flex a little bit, it's a humbling reminder that I ain't shit. Which makes me feel better about myself for some weird reason.

[sonick]

Originally Posted by PeanutButter

I guess I feel a sense of guilt for some reason. Like, I'm living this perfect life. It's like what did I do to deserve the life I'm living? I have my own place, I have a beautiful family and a healthy relationship with my spouse, and I can go on multiple vacations a year and I religiously put money away for my retirement.

As time goes on, I have multiple friends who are going to be f*cked as they will likely still have debt, they'll have nothing saved, and when they're 70 years old, you can't live pay cheque to pay cheque because you likely can't work at the same level anymore.

A common distortion of trauma or anxiety is downplaying positives and too heavily attributing success to luck of the draw.

It's healthy to recognize luck has a part in success (they say the biggest narcissists are those who attribute all the positive in life purely on their own talent and intelligence), but also to have a good balance of self assurance of one's own capabilities.

You said it yourself in the other thread about classic Chinese/Asian mentality of growing up. Not believing you are deserving of good things in life is a classic traumatic result of that upbringing. Also the fear that if you start believing your own shit smells good then you'll lose that drive or urgency to get what got you there in the first place.

I've had a hard time reconciling it myself but after much counselling and self reflection I've started to give myself compassion for things rather than beating myself up thay I don't "deserve" anything, coz ultimately I realized it's not helping me be a better person at work or personally. In fact I feel I perform even better professionally since I started believing in my own abilities and not simply because ingot lucky and am not deserving of my relative success.

[Badhobz]

I know a lot of Chinese dudes like that and you’re right, they deserve all their successes. Unfortunately it’s culturally ingrained to always do better and to not be boastful of your accomplishments.

That’s why I keep telling my buddy to let loose his purse string and buy the car he wants. He makes good money, he has a small-ish mortgage and his wife makes decent money too. But he’s raised to be a super cheapass and it’s costing him his happiness. Not saying that material goods will bring him happiness but hoarding cash isn’t exactly helping his case. He’s not planning on having kids either so the goal is to burn it all before you kick the bucket

You’re all invited to my 70 year old cocaine, hookers, guns fest. I don’t plan on being around for the adult diaper, kidney dialysis days so I’m gonna go out in style.

[sonick]

I think it's good to not be boastful and to be humble, but at the same time it can get hammered so deeply into the Chinese psyche growing up that you don't allow YOURSELF to feel pride and recognition of your own achievements, and that's where it becomes self-sabotoging and success limiting.

It got to a point for me where I'd make a great presentation, or a great speech, and get a ton of positive feedback and and compliments, but I'd go home and feel like shit and beat myself up coz I didn't think I earned those compliments. That's when I realized how fucked up it was and I should sort that shit out.

I also learned and realized oftentimes people don't know they are especially strong or talented at something. It comes so naturally to them that it doesn't feel like it takes a lot of effort. Which then also contributes to the idea of not deserving success because it didn't feel like a lot of effort to achieve.

[snowball]

I had friends buy their houses in 2015 and 2017. We bought our house in 2022. So they spend their Friday nights out at restaurants and buying their kids tons of toys. I spend my Friday nights browsing flyers looking for deals so I can eat next week. We make much more than them as well.

[RabidRat]

Wealth disparity among friends:

Originally Posted by PeanutButter

We're all around 40 now and i'm not sure if it's because of our age or because of covid, but it feels like there is a huge income disparity amoung my friends these days. Or maybe it was always there and I didn't realize it.

[...]

And now that I think of it, I look at my group and you can really see the income disparity, We're all highschool friends, so the demographic of the group is pretty diverse.

The more I think about it, the more sad I get. I know money isn't the be all end all, but in our city, money is a huge stress for so many people.

I'm not really sure what's to be done about this, but just curious if you guys are in a similar boat with your friends?

If anything, it feels like the disparity has reduced over the years among my friends, across grade school, university, and through work.

I grew up in east van, but took the bus to school on the west side for programs my parents wanted me in. That meant I went to school and made friends with a mix of kids from family backgrounds like mine, vs others whose parents were clearly wealthy. It was generally fine, though sometimes awkward like in Grade 4 when a parent was driving me home and they were like "uh... we've been driving a reeeally long time now, are you sure we shouldn't have turned to get to your house by now?" lol.

Anyway after we went to university, that was kind of the equalizer: we had the opportunity to go out and generate our own wealth. Most of my friends are doing pretty ok by now, with a few exceptions that came out of them choosing a career path based purely on passion/interest which didn't happen to line up with economic viability (e.g. Environmental Science -> Aquarium staff).

"At least doing ok" really runs a wide range in our group. Literally $80k - $700k. But the point is that we don't notice it in practice. Back to Mazlow's Hierarchy of Needs: I think at $80k, you're near the top of not having joy level impacted by money (provided you're not trying to keep up with anybody but yourself). It means certain things like buying a condo rather than a detached, and maybe going on vacation a little less often. But really doesn't impact things on the cashflow level.


Hangouts not affordable for all within the group:

Originally Posted by PeanutButter

I just found out one of our really good friends doesn't hang out with us anymore because he can't afford to. It's not like we go to super extravagant dinners, but it would probably be like $40-$100 for the night out.

Despite the disparity in our income, that doesn't affect our group hangouts at all. Whenever we hang out, the stuff we do doesn't cost very much: the real value is in seeing each other and doing quality catch-up. The venue / activity does not matter. Getting together at someone's place for a potluck holiday dinner, going for a drive, going camping, etc. Even going on vacation together has not been an issue: it's just often we go on a big trip together depends on how comfortable they are, I guess.

Going to Germany a week for Oktoberfest and track time on the Nurburgring was the most spendy we've ever been, and was not a strain for anyone.

Maybe the difference is that we're a bunch of cheap fucks and we're not that creative about using our money .


Questionable behavior in a friend:

Originally Posted by PeanutButter

Another buddy apparently owes almost everyone in our group money (including me) to some degree or another. What's really bad about this friend is that he still spends money on stupid shit. His latest move was to ask my buddy to grab him a ticket to a show which was like $150 and he's not paying him back.

Kinda hard to tell what is going on with this: not enough data to know if where this is on the spectrum of "well-meaning lack of self-control" to "deliberate taking advantage of others", but any way you slice it, it doesn't seem positive.

You are influenced by the closest people in your life. Something to think about!


Motivation to come on this forum:

Originally Posted by PeanutButter

I think this is my favourite part of this forum. When I see members flex a little bit, it's a humbling reminder that I ain't shit. Which makes me feel better about myself for some weird reason.

I generally feel ok about where I am, but I like coming on these forums and having examples among you to look up to.

• Some of you are super accomplished in your line of work.
• Some of you are really thoughtful about your investments and prudent with financial planning.
• Some of you have seen a lot of shit, thought profoundly on what life is about.
• Some of you are stand-out exceptional parents to your kids, and kids to your parents.
• Some of you are just fucking heroes, helping people out when they're in a jam.
• And some of you are real assholes, which has been a great prompt for self-reflection .

[bcrdukes]

Originally Posted by RabidRat

And some of you are real assholes, which has been a great prompt for self-reflection .

No way!!! Not on this forum! :

[68style]

Originally Posted by supafamous

I can't believe you Richmond boys aren't getting your fried chicken from LA Chicken. The shame.

That place has gone downhill in my opinion... bit of a shame... you can tell they're not doing that well with all the other fried chicken places that have popped up. Their pricing is out of this world too.

[whitev70r]

Yah, last time I was in the LA Chicken area and wanted a snack, after looking at the menu, I had to walk out. You have to make Badhobz salary to eat there .

Popeye's? Or Mary Brown's? And now there is practically a Korean Fried chicken place on every other corner. #anyplaceexceptKFC

[Hondaracer]

I think Mary B’s for regular chicken, Popeyes for everything else

The Mary B’s in Kamloops makes a mean bucket lol

[Badhobz]

Is it me or is that poor dude in LA chicken looking like he’s always 1 drumstick away from a murder suicide rampage ?!

[Tapioca]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

I don't think hanging out at a restaurant is all that anyways after covid. You aren't getting much chatting done if there's more than 8 ppl in a fancy restaurant, and which I agree sometimes ends up being a dick measuring contest. The cheaper the food the better the fun.

The good hang outs are actually heading to some one's house, do a BBQ or just late night grab some snacks and some beers or wine. I've covered the BBQ at our place for the last 2 years. If we went out it would cost us $100 for the two of us, that $100 is typically enough to cover BBQ food for at least 4-6 ppl and have ppl bring your own booze.

Everyone on this thread and forum owns a detached house. The easiest thing to do to make your friends feel comfortable about the wealth disparity is to host (and host often) and not expect friends to bring anything (though everyone brings their own booze or a bottle of wine anyway).

We've hosted our friends for years (no potlucks). We usually source our food from Costco and focus on presentation (my wife has a variety of dishware and likes to be creative when it comes to food), which makes everyone, regardless of where they are in life, comfortable and relaxed. We hosted 5 households a few weeks ago and paid about $200 for the food, which is not a lot these days for some good times.

[whitev70r]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

Is it me or is that poor dude in LA chicken looking like he’s always 1 drumstick away from a murder suicide rampage ?!

... so true, he is the fried chicken nazi of Seinfeld.

[Badhobz]

Originally Posted by Tapioca

Everyone on this thread and forum owns a detached house. The easiest thing to do to make your friends feel comfortable about the wealth disparity is to host (and host often) and not expect friends to bring anything (though everyone brings their own booze or a bottle of wine anyway).

Yes that’s another reason why I usually don’t like inviting people over to my place. Before in my little shitty rat shack it isn’t so blatant and in your face, but now it’s pretty damn bad. Especially if some of the guys are having problems making ends meet.

I usually just say we go out to a park or something and then nobody has to clean up their homes before / after such an event.

[JqC]

Great thread.

But all I got from that first page is that I really need to meet this Badhobz dude now.
If I'm ever so lucky, I'm gonna give him shit for posting that KFC pic (cause it's awesome), then beg him to buy me a few Family Size buckets to bring home to my kids cause I know he can afford it.